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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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@Romeo- Yea, I guess I have to work on making eyes the right size. practice~

@Arkillian- Thank you for your speech. It made sense to me. :]
And yes crit on 3D rendering would be appreciated.

Also, the reason I'm trying a piece that is more like "realism" (excuse my use) is because I want to get into an art program in university, and I heard they frown upon anime-style in portfolios. I'm thinking on starting my portfolio soon, so I'm practising. This piece is, I guess, my measuring stick to see where I am, what I have to do to improve.

It doesn't mean I'm giving up my older style for good, I just want to make people I draw less stylized (because at the moment, they really are). This sentence is contradictory, but I'm not sure how to explain what I mean.

Here is where I'm at with this picture at the moment.
Spoiler:
Image

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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

Waiting on Godot...

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Ok- if you're wanting your whole style to be less stylised, then I suggest finding some how to books on drawing realistically. Those will show you the proportions of an acurate human face (a western one anyways >.> I believe asian faces are different proportions? It's handy to be able to draw many different face shapes if you're serious about art as a career.)

The book I learnt to draw from is Jack Hamm- How to draw the head and Figure. This book is old school though- it was first printed in the 1950s I believe, so it DOES have that oldschool charm to it like a mallet to the face BUT... this is the important thing- I personally haven't found a book with a better tutorial on how to draw proportions of the human figure. All other books scratch on this one. There are probably better ones, but out of what I've seen, this is the best. And cause it's old and in black and white, it's really affordable too. I believe that his will have tutorials on relaxing the extremeness of the anime in your art so it maybe isn't fully realistic proportion (It'll take you years to like drawing realistic proportions. Don't push yourself. Draw how you think looks best not how you think they wan to see it), but is closer. It'll also help with the shape of the head and eyes and stuff.

I also think you'd benifit as heavily as I did with Gary Faigin - The Artist's Complete Guide To Facial Expression. Because of this I went from hit and miss expressions to subtly and high impact expression. Knowing what parts of the face more when you smile or frown is a powerful tool in art for grabbing the viewer. See, right now your portrait of the girl is nice, but lacks an impact that will grab the attention of the judges who are looking at your art because she doesn't have an expression as such. Her face is completely relaxed, yet her eyes are wide open. the simple task of flattening the top of her eyelids will relax her eyes also, and give her a content expression.

One other thing with portraits- Asian faces tend to be very smooth and featureless- I get that, but when you draw a western face atleast, they tend to be more shapely and have features that when you think about it too much look almost 'ugly'. There's NOTHING wrong with having sunken in areas under the eyes, forehead creases, and laugh lines. This is character. You'll find when you think of a face less about what the features are and leaving them out cause it's ugly, and more about character and lighting, that the features are actually interesting to look at and add some story to your subject. Don't worry about the result and if it'll look good. It's ... one thing that irks me a little about some artists is that they stop the flow of inspiration and critique their art without drawing till they actually have a problem. When you start doing this, your art doesn't flow so much. If you are stopping because you're worried that the judges wont like it, then you're thinking too much. Mind of no mind hon- draw what feels right, and it'll come out fluid like water. Art shouldn't take effort if you have the basics- like martial arts. Learn the basics, then let your body take over for you. Your inspiration. If you have a break in your flow, you're thinking too much and you need to stop thinking, and if you can't do it cause it doesn't look right, then you need to practise your basics. Don't feel embarrassed by that. It's like martial arts- art requires training, dedication, and passion.

Now, if you'll excuse my Zen approach to art, I hope what I've said will help out. I've talked to ALOT of good artists abotu it and how they do it, and I firmly believe to be any good at art, you need to drill the basics into you. Once you've done that, then let it go. Your mind and hands know what to do. Don't jumble that up with extra junk it doesn't need to worry about :) Actually- on more book that helps you do this is Betty Edwards - Drawing from the Right side of the brain. If you can go through this book and not draw beter, then you either know it already and aren't practising it, or you stopped cause it was too difficult. This is a gallery of students who have done the course from this book (all the exersises are in the book) with a before and arfter shot of how thier art is. Sometimes all you need to do is just train your eye to look at things correctly. Apparently I taught myself all of this by mistake when I was a kid, but anyone can do it. How to look at something as shapes- not things.

Anyways- I'll stop now ^^; Lol.
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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Thank you so much Arkillian! You comparing art to martial arts helped me understand more about how to draw.

I'll see if I can get my hands on those books you mentioned! //Needs to get a source of income first.

I read your post like five times over, absorbing information and inspiration.
You helped me a lot, thanks!
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

Waiting on Godot...

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Heh- I'm full of all sorts of useless information :) I'm glad I made sense XD
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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Personally, I've become rather fond of drawing characters with more wrinkles and creases in their faces. I think it was because I grew bored of drawing smooth faces. I think it suits my style better, plus I actually like drawing European faces.

Now if you ask me, there's just no getting around it: art isn't some mysterious talent that only certain people can pick up right away--you just need the right mindset. And you can do it by working at it; you'll get somewhere eventually if you realize that not being talented doesn't prevent you from improving or being good at art.

Having a good eye for art certainly does help you. For example, changing what medium you draw with doesn't affect the quality of your art much. You'll still know what a sideview eye looks like, regardless of whether you're using crayons or a tablet. And you'll notice it in other people's artwork too. It's almost horrifying to have to explain it, but as you get better at noticing these things, more things fail to impress you. When you get better at noticing these details, they might prevent you from enjoying the work as much as you used to. If you can accept that, then it's alright to keep improving. You might occasionally find something really good--and because few others are as good as it, you treasure it more. And the longer it stays enjoyable, the more valuable it is.

But I guess it's a good way of knowing if you've gotten better.
Pauca sed matura.

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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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CRITICIZE ME!

Spoiler: Picture 1
Image


There is tons of stuff wrong with this picture, I just feel it. Please tell what mistakes exactly I made and give me advice on how I could possibly avoid those in the future.

Spoiler: Picture 2
Image


I think something about the perspective is off, but I can't really put my finger on it... Please, I need some help in finding the error and learning how to avoid it. :franny:

Thank you in advance! :maya:
Image

...Because I felt the need to advertise my fanfic with a self-drawn, animated banner. Yes, I'm obsessed, why do you ask?
Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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Neni wrote:
CRITICIZE ME!

Spoiler: Picture 1
Image


There is tons of stuff wrong with this picture, I just feel it. Please tell what mistakes exactly I made and give me advice on how I could possibly avoid those in the future.

Spoiler: Picture 2
Image


I think something about the perspective is off, but I can't really put my finger on it... Please, I need some help in finding the error and learning how to avoid it. :franny:

Thank you in advance! :maya:


The fatal flaw in your pictures is that the legs are very small, length wise. It does depend on her (Pic 1's) age, yes, but i'm guessing shes roughly...16 to 18 years old? I'd say she has around a...1/5 or 1/6 body proportion, which is very chibi. Nothing wrong with it, infact I draw with these proportions a lot of the time. However it feels like you're not trying to acheive the chibi look- a more grown up look. Lengthen the legs out, and you'll find this is what the picture needs to look a bit better.

Other nitpicks:
-The eys, in my opinion, are too close together. There should, according to my rules, be enough room for one eye between the eys, at the moment there's room for half an eye. If you were trying to acheive a look where shes looking to the side then it doesn't look right either-I'm not sure what to say.
-Her stomach sort of are seems to stick out a great deal, this wouldn't be a very comfortable pose in real life-this is fine if you're wanting to acheive a stylised look, but if you want to lean towards realism then make poses less dramatic. I find if you want to do a pose, see if it's possible by doing what you want infront of a mirror.
-Her neck is very tapered, I know I shouldn't be saying this because I taper my necks like CRAZY, but i thought I might as well point it out.

I think this is a great picture though and she certainly looks very creative so, like everyone else, keep trying!

[/Wow...now I know what Arkillian means that she hopes she didnt rant after a reaallly long post.
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

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Jay wrote:
Personally, I've become rather fond of drawing characters with more wrinkles and creases in their faces. I think it was because I grew bored of drawing smooth faces. I think it suits my style better, plus I actually like drawing European faces.

Now if you ask me, there's just no getting around it: art isn't some mysterious talent that only certain people can pick up right away--you just need the right mindset. And you can do it by working at it; you'll get somewhere eventually if you realize that not being talented doesn't prevent you from improving or being good at art.

Having a good eye for art certainly does help you. For example, changing what medium you draw with doesn't affect the quality of your art much. You'll still know what a sideview eye looks like, regardless of whether you're using crayons or a tablet. And you'll notice it in other people's artwork too. It's almost horrifying to have to explain it, but as you get better at noticing these things, more things fail to impress you. When you get better at noticing these details, they might prevent you from enjoying the work as much as you used to. If you can accept that, then it's alright to keep improving. You might occasionally find something really good--and because few others are as good as it, you treasure it more. And the longer it stays enjoyable, the more valuable it is.

But I guess it's a good way of knowing if you've gotten better.


This is true. I've grown to enjoy drawing older men cause I like drawing the 'manly' type men. I'm not a popular artist cause of it around here though >.> I think it's unrealistic to believe that every face should be perfect. Alot of art I ignore now if it is of a perfectly drawn person with perfect features. I actually find asians dull to draw cause of their featureless skin. I'm a big fan of people with cheek bones you can see, and strong face shapes. That may be because I deal mostly in Western art however. alot of people that draw in an Eastern style only see others drawing Asians so I guess it's the same for them. I'm trying though. I've drawn a few asians.

I know what you mean about enjoying art less when you get better at it, but I find it easier to appreciate art when it's not copied. I find copied art difficult to appreciate. It's essential for learning, sure, but it's repetitive. I find myself going 'Urgh, another person drew that Sweeney Todd pose' or 'Someone copied that sprite and didn't get it right'. I also pet peeve about people that copy the style of te original artist when drawing their own art. Not cause I think it looks crap- people can do it well. Mostly cause I know just HOW MUCH it holds you back as an artist- out of experience, drawing DBZ for 3 years held my art back for 6 as I got myself back into my own style of art. It disappoints me to see people not trying their own path with art. See, if I want to see a perfect rendition of Miles like the original artist, I'd look for canon art. I want to see some new and exciting styles of art however. That's what I love about fanart. Everything is so new and exciting :) That's why I started this thread- cause I hoped that people would brave their own styles of art and get better at it so I could see some exciting new fanart out there :)

Hrmmm- the way I know I've gotten better is that I compare art from a year ago to art of now. If I can say I've improved, and where I've improved, then that's all I care about. There will ALWAYS be artists better than you, more popular than you, that can draw certain things better than you, but to compare yourself to them is stupid, cause if you and the other artist had the same level of skill, your art would look nothing alike, so it's like saying you like apples more than you like pears. Well, some people like pears more, and some people think both pears and apples are awesome. If you love your art, then that to me is the only audience that you need to win over :)

My way of thinking is VERY non competitive though, and I get told off for it. To me, amateur artists should all think like this cause the competitive market is totally different, and it's depressing. It's a swarm of swooping vultures all squawking, and fighting to get their share of a dead carcass. It scares the @#$% out of me, which is why I'd NEVER consider art for a job. I'd lose my love for it so fast.
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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Romeo wrote:
The fatal flaw in your pictures is that the legs are very small, length wise. It does depend on her (Pic 1's) age, yes, but i'm guessing shes roughly...16 to 18 years old? I'd say she has around a...1/5 or 1/6 body proportion, which is very chibi. Nothing wrong with it, infact I draw with these proportions a lot of the time. However it feels like you're not trying to acheive the chibi look- a more grown up look. Lengthen the legs out, and you'll find this is what the picture needs to look a bit better.


Ah, that... Heheh, I should have maybe explained it better:

This girl is from my fanfic. And, despite being an adult, one of her traits is that she's short. Like, way too short for her age. She regularly uses that fact to pass herself off as much younger than she actually is. So, yeah, despite her looking grumpy I was going for the Chibi look... Kind of. I can, however, understand, why it seems unfitting. That was kinda intentional, since.. eh, I'll throw a fanfic quote in here:

Quote:
Actually, she would have been quite cute. [...] Admittedly, her build seemed otherwise a little too developed for her age. Based on certain aspects, she could have passed for a short 18-year-old easily. [...]
Adorable, however, she was not. To blame for that was mostly that grumpy look on her face.
[JFI, The character who is narrating doesn't know her real age and is guessing wrong.]


Still, thank you. It's good to see that people even notice that disonance.

Romeo wrote:
Other nitpicks:
-The eys, in my opinion, are too close together. There should, according to my rules, be enough room for one eye between the eys, at the moment there's room for half an eye. If you were trying to acheive a look where shes looking to the side then it doesn't look right either-I'm not sure what to say.


One-eye distance between the eyes... got it! I will keep that in mind, thank you!^^
As for the look seeming wrong... I guess it's the eye shape, but I'm not sure either... -.-;

Romeo wrote:
-Her stomach sort of are seems to stick out a great deal, this wouldn't be a very comfortable pose in real life-this is fine if you're wanting to acheive a stylised look, but if you want to lean towards realism then make poses less dramatic. I find if you want to do a pose, see if it's possible by doing what you want infront of a mirror.


That's ironic, considering that this was the first pic ever I actually did pose before a mirror for.
But, yeah, that pose wasn't comfotable when I did it, I admit that... *back cracks* ...Ouch! ><
I was going for something overly dramatic, due to the character's personality. In the end, however, she ended up looking like Calisto Yew... T-T


Romeo wrote:
-Her neck is very tapered, I know I shouldn't be saying this because I taper my necks like CRAZY, but i thought I might as well point it out.

Alright, I'll try to consider that.

Romeo wrote:
I think this is a great picture though and she certainly looks very creative so, like everyone else, keep trying!


Aww!! Thank you! :pearl-blush:
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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Heat Guy J

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Arkillian wrote:
Jay wrote:
Personally, I've become rather fond of drawing characters with more wrinkles and creases in their faces. I think it was because I grew bored of drawing smooth faces. I think it suits my style better, plus I actually like drawing European faces.

Now if you ask me, there's just no getting around it: art isn't some mysterious talent that only certain people can pick up right away--you just need the right mindset. And you can do it by working at it; you'll get somewhere eventually if you realize that not being talented doesn't prevent you from improving or being good at art.

Having a good eye for art certainly does help you. For example, changing what medium you draw with doesn't affect the quality of your art much. You'll still know what a sideview eye looks like, regardless of whether you're using crayons or a tablet. And you'll notice it in other people's artwork too. It's almost horrifying to have to explain it, but as you get better at noticing these things, more things fail to impress you. When you get better at noticing these details, they might prevent you from enjoying the work as much as you used to. If you can accept that, then it's alright to keep improving. You might occasionally find something really good--and because few others are as good as it, you treasure it more. And the longer it stays enjoyable, the more valuable it is.

But I guess it's a good way of knowing if you've gotten better.


This is true. I've grown to enjoy drawing older men cause I like drawing the 'manly' type men. I'm not a popular artist cause of it around here though >.> I think it's unrealistic to believe that every face should be perfect. Alot of art I ignore now if it is of a perfectly drawn person with perfect features. I actually find asians dull to draw cause of their featureless skin. I'm a big fan of people with cheek bones you can see, and strong face shapes. That may be because I deal mostly in Western art however. alot of people that draw in an Eastern style only see others drawing Asians so I guess it's the same for them. I'm trying though. I've drawn a few asians.


I don't mind drawing smooth faced characters every now and then; that is to say that I haven't decided I'm never going to draw another smooth faced character ever again, but it does cause problems for me if I'm trying to draw women. Part of getting better includes drawing anything and everything possible; so now that you can draw one kind of character, what if you wanted to draw them in an image with another kind of character that looks different? You'd have difficulty unless you can draw a diverse variety of characters.

I'm privy to appreciating artwork which contains any character in it, no matter what they look like--I'm just more concerned with how they execute it. So I can still appreciate artwork which contains popular anime characters in them (which are, by and large, hugely dominated by Asian-looking, smooth faced characters); I'm just really picky about which ones I appreciate.

Quote:
I know what you mean about enjoying art less when you get better at it, but I find it easier to appreciate art when it's not copied. I find copied art difficult to appreciate. It's essential for learning, sure, but it's repetitive. I find myself going 'Urgh, another person drew that Sweeney Todd pose' or 'Someone copied that sprite and didn't get it right'. I also pet peeve about people that copy the style of te original artist when drawing their own art. Not cause I think it looks crap- people can do it well. Mostly cause I know just HOW MUCH it holds you back as an artist- out of experience, drawing DBZ for 3 years held my art back for 6 as I got myself back into my own style of art. It disappoints me to see people not trying their own path with art. See, if I want to see a perfect rendition of Miles like the original artist, I'd look for canon art. I want to see some new and exciting styles of art however. That's what I love about fanart. Everything is so new and exciting :) That's why I started this thread- cause I hoped that people would brave their own styles of art and get better at it so I could see some exciting new fanart out there :)


That's actually what I believe too. Why would you want to see a third-rate version of the original artist's work? Instead of seeing someone's copy of a popular manga panel, why not just read the manga itself? I like seeing fanart when it's done from a fresh perspective--that the artist drawing the image has something to share with us that we haven't already seen. We may know who the character is and recognize him, but the artist should express what he thinks about the character through his art. That's part of the stuff we don't know.

Trying to copy manga or anime panels or screenshots doesn't improve your art; drawing from real life does though. The problem with the former is that you don't learn anything by trying to learn the simplified and exaggerated anatomy from some other artist; you don't know what the basic anatomy should look like. After you do enough studying from real life drawings, you can exaggerate and simplify your style as much as you want; but it doesn't work the other way around. You simply just can't learn anatomy by watching the exaggerations and simplifications of other artists because you don't know what's being exaggerated or simplified.

Quote:
Hrmmm- the way I know I've gotten better is that I compare art from a year ago to art of now. If I can say I've improved, and where I've improved, then that's all I care about. There will ALWAYS be artists better than you, more popular than you, that can draw certain things better than you, but to compare yourself to them is stupid, cause if you and the other artist had the same level of skill, your art would look nothing alike, so it's like saying you like apples more than you like pears. Well, some people like pears more, and some people think both pears and apples are awesome. If you love your art, then that to me is the only audience that you need to win over :)


Actually, I wrote an article somewhere about the seven deadly si(g)ns of improvement... I suppose it was more satire than seriousness because I made it seem unpleasant.

That no two artists of the same skill level can draw things exactly the same is exactly the same reason why it's so easy to tell if someone plagiarizes your art. Your own style is a unique characteristic of your art. It will always exist to some degree. But I'm not sure if popularity means anything because you can be popular by drawing popular manga or anime subjects, and still not be good. I don't consider myself popular, yet I consider myself a better artist than most people who do nothing but copy manga or anime panels, and I think their art gets more attention than mine does. I'm just simply not good at selling myself. But I agree that I'm much happier drawing what I want to draw rather than drawing what people want to see me draw. It may mean not being as popular, but I'd be happier with a smaller crowd that actually appreciates my art for what it is, rather than simply liking the fact that I drew their favorite manga/anime character.

Quote:
My way of thinking is VERY non competitive though, and I get told off for it. To me, amateur artists should all think like this cause the competitive market is totally different, and it's depressing. It's a swarm of swooping vultures all squawking, and fighting to get their share of a dead carcass. It scares the @#$% out of me, which is why I'd NEVER consider art for a job. I'd lose my love for it so fast.


Ja, if you drew for a living, you don't have a choice over what you want to draw. Art is time consuming, and if you spend time drawing things you don't like to draw (even if you can do it), you can't really enjoy it.

I do occasionally join the odd art contest here and there, but it's usually just to get ideas for drawing stuff, and not really to win. If everyone who entered was much better or much worse than I was, I wouldn't really care; I'd just be happy that it inspired me to draw something I might not have thought of.
Pauca sed matura.

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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

Waiting on Godot...

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I agree on most points there Jay, but if you do it right, you should be able to get somethign from every picture you draw. I disapprove of drawing from grids heavily, because you don't end up putting your own flare into it, and it ends up looking flat. tracing and drawing from a grid to me are two of the same evils. Copying a picture however, as much as I dislike looking at the same picture over and over again, if the artist puts in effort rather than drawing Miles just to say that you drew Miles, then you can actually learn alot about other things to do with art.

When I was getting out of my DBZ thing, I fell in love with an artist, Greg Lands style of art, and aspired to have his feel. To do this, I first started out drawing a picture as closely as I could to his art style
Spoiler: Picture I copied
ImageImage


I labelled it clearly as a copy of an image so people know it was a copy, but even though I made a truck tone of mistakes from the original, I found out alot of techniques that I liked, and others that just didn't go well with me. I only ever did it a few times so that I could get a feel, and then went straight onto doing my own thing, keeping what I learnt in mind. My current style looks VERY different to Greg Land's now as a consequence, but I was heavily inspired
Spoiler: A more recent picture of a girl- currently unfinished
Image
Yeah- it's a Dr Who picture :) I'm really loving the new Doctor ^^


So... yeah. As much as I despise the practise, as long as it's not a trace or grid, then in minor amounts it's ok. You're right though. Nothing beats having photographic references. Noone wants to not learn from another artist's mistakes. There's not many artists out there you can reference with accuracy.

Neni- Sorry, I was pressed for time with my last post. It was getting late so I decided to put off responding.

Lilie Heatherd- I think why Romeo was so confused about your picture is because you haven't told the story about who she is with your picture. There's too much information that you need to convey in this picture all at once for your current skill level in art. I don't want to sound rude saying that, but if your audience is confused, then you need to simplify the message, cause otherwise it comes out garbled. Being a short female is fine. How short is she? 5 foot? 4 foot? Does she have dwarfism? Average proportions for an adult female is about 1:8 or 1:7.5. These are only approximates of course. I'd suspect that a 5' lady would be 1:7 or 1:6.5, and 4' ladies to be a 1:6. You should make it clear when you want critique what her height is since it is below average- alot of people crit based on an average. For a character shot however, simplify her personality down to being REALLY short (if she is really short), and not so much the school girl side. If she's just slightly below average, then making her height so extremely low in proportion throws people off. You want to throw the school girl curve ball when you WANT to shock your audience, but putting her in a natural situation for a girl, and BAM! There's hints of adult there. That's how you play the mind screw game- hinting extra stuff. Unless your audience knows the character, then go to town- but here at CR, we don't :( Lastly, your picture is on a sever tilt to the left. That would be throwing you off. I use to find that I did that too cause I was working at a desk (that and I'm half blind) If you rule a line down the middle of the page/ which ever way gravity goes, then as long as you balance half the body's weight on one side, and the other half on the other side, it'll be balanced.

Franziska- The leg she seems to be leaning on is shorter than her other leg. You need to use a reference for her pose rather than guessing till you understand why a pose works and balance. Posemaniacs should help, also photos off the net. Here's a posemaniacs pose that looks similar to how I'd invision Franziska to stand. (Just don't rotate it too much. Those dynamic standing poses lose their accuracy the further around the back you go O.o Wow- they screwed up there >.> Normally they're pretty good...)
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title
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The Hoosiers :) Just too cool.

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oh hi well i knew that i was pretty bad (ok,REALLY BAD) at drawing hands and feet so started to draw more of them and i think i got better, but i would like some crit on them please :D (also i haven't been posting much on here cos my scanner is being evil and ive been drawing mainly by hand)
Spoiler: hand and foot.
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my sprites Image(click the pic for pandas graphics~)
Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

Waiting on Godot...

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I'm not sure what level detail you're looking for here, but I suggest going all out with the learning stage and drawing hands as realistically as you can, THEN cartooning them. All animators take life drawing, and although it doesn't look it with their art, they actually know proportion with their art, and they know how to warp it to make it more fun. I took life drawing at an animation school for two terms. it's great cause it gives you a sense of depth so you can imagine objects as 3D rather than just a pose. Like, I met my friend Lucky there- his animation style is like this but he's also good at throwing together a realistic version with accurate proportions in life drawing REALLY fast. Even if you're just learning from a photo thoguh, doing it realistically first is better. that way, you know what you're cutting out of the pic. Do lots of poses too. Otherwise you'll be limited what you can draw. Keep up the pratise, and good luck :)
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ケーキたん(仮)

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Hey there, Ark. Once again, I would like to hear some of your words of wisdom. :)

Lately I've been trying to improve moreso with Photoshop coloring, and I'd like to ask for your comments/critique on my latest pic. It's a bit dirty in a few areas(you'll know where), but yeah.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, maybe nws
http://akuuu.deviantart.com/#/d31gmr5
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johnny rainbow wrote:
Hey there, Ark. Once again, I would like to hear some of your words of wisdom. :)

Lately I've been trying to improve moreso with Photoshop coloring, and I'd like to ask for your comments/critique on my latest pic. It's a bit dirty in a few areas(you'll know where), but yeah.

http://akuuu.deviantart.com/#/d31gmr5


Well, the first and most obvious thing for me is the pelvis area (not for that reason) because the pelvis is flat down, but the torso is straight up. It makes her look like her back has gained half a foot in length. For that angle of tilt in the pelvis, she needs to be laying down on her back, or to be propped up by her elbows and glancing over her knees.

Here's an eastern styled picture of a girl that is sort of resting back on her elbows (contains panty shot)

Here's something closer to what you look like you're going for with shows less... panty :) It still contins panty though

As you see, when you roll onto your lowerback, you can see that area (can I call the areas of the groin by their proper terms on this site? O.O ), but when you're sitting up right, that area is touching the surface it sits on.

Spoiler: Grrr... we all know what 'that area' is but incase you don't like to read it, it is written here
The vagina. Damn it, am I allowed to type that without a spoiler or call it the groin? Groin is such a general term >.>


Besides that, things seem ok with it. I'm not sure why the pinky purple colour is so bright even though it's under the blue, but it has an effect so it's totally forgivable :) Hope that helps ^^
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ケーキたん(仮)

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...ahhh I see it, after the first example you posted(can't see the 2nd one for some reason). Thanks for the critique!

Regarding the pink, I originally just wrote with blue but felt it was lacking, so I went over with pink and it seemed to go decent together.

And vagina seems appropriate enough, if you ask me. We're not trying to push profanity in this instance. ;P
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Is it intentional that you now have 1337 posts?
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Darth GW7 wrote:
Is it intentional that you now have 1337 posts?


What- you saying that the art is only good stuff? I'll crit anything. Or I'll try to. It's a little difficult if the artist doesn't have some basic knowledge. I like to think also that people are improving in art with my crit ^^; I'm sorry if I'm scaring off some artists that want crit. I am trying my best to give useful comments :( It is hard to be told negative stuff about your art. I've had my fair share of blows to my artistic ego. At one point I was told that my art style was crap and I was better 5 years before then. You just have to get back onto your feet and decide either that the person is telling shit, or that it really could be better and do something about it. I mean, it's difficult not to be bias with crit because style is so fluid, and so interpretive. One man's ideal art style is another man's trash.

Johnny- I think their website is down- I was going off google images, but essentially, you want a pose where they are sitting down normally like a chair but with the legs higher. This pose maniacs pose has higher bent legs, and it's a guy but maybe it'll help? ^^;
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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Okay its me again back with some new art-but this one i'd like evryone to crit differently.
Instead of criticising on the proportion, form and all the technicalities, I want you to comment on if you can see these twos relationship from the picture-can you make an estimate at their personalities?

You can criticise on the more important things as well but the primary focus I want criticised here is can you see what I was trying to convey, and if not how can I?

Spoiler: a la normal, big.
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Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

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Romeo wrote:
Okay its me again back with some new art-but this one i'd like evryone to crit differently.
Instead of criticising on the proportion, form and all the technicalities, I want you to comment on if you can see these twos relationship from the picture-can you make an estimate at their personalities?

You can criticise on the more important things as well but the primary focus I want criticised here is can you see what I was trying to convey, and if not how can I?

Spoiler: a la normal, big.
Image


That's cool. Specifics make it easier to critique.

Now, the problem with doing crit on what you are asking for is that proportion issues and other minor things WILL actually interfere with how the person is interpreted, so when I say that you seem like you were going for a cool gangster type character with the guy, and a bad girl type thing with the girl, I am actually taking a stab in the dark a little, cause the proportions make it difficult to read their body language. I made these guesses cause they were the clothing of the stereo types I mentioned, but the facial expressions lack the micro expression and angle required to pull it off. I use to have the same problem as you till I got this book, and learnt micro expression. Till then, the facial side of body language will lack punch, cause your whole face contorts in different ways to express itself.

I couldn't tell you how to fix this till I knew what you wanted to convey, sorry :( Conveying a personality is a full body crit because every personality is different. I think this is the best way I can put this ^^; Oh, and also colour can cure alot of evils with personality too. It's something you should give a go with, even if it 'turns out crap' at first. You'll always get better at something you practice :) Good to see you still going at it ^^ I'm seeing some improvements in your art :) Keep up the good work ^^
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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Problem with colouring is the only colouring tools I have are felt tips, pencils or paint. I'd say pencils are my safest bet, as I can use them reasonably well.
Thanks for your criticism about 'micro expression', thats like, a titlt of the eyebrow and its a completley different expression, right? Yeah, still working on it. I have been comparing myself to earlier works and I have to say its made me realise how much better I have gotten
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Good on you Romeo :) If drawing is something you're passionate about, you may need to support yourself with it, or ask your parents to help. Digital is a one of cost which can be good, but don't go digital due to money. Go digital if you enjoy it. I had to buy my own art stuffs my whole life, and right up to 6 months ago, I was using the cheep faber castel student colouring in pencils set to colour my art with. You know- those 48 packs you get? I'm using the Polychromos now which are the professional quality ones, but there's ALOT you can do with coloured pencil, Like I drew this picture of some of my OCs using coloured pencil and ink years ago, and this one had white pen to give glowing highlights. I used all sorts of stuff in my art to make up for lack of quality in my art stuff. More recently, this picture of Dr who was done in a set of $30 coloured pencils- Your art isn't as good as what you draw with- sure, that can effect your potential output, but your art is as good as you are at making use of them.

If you like coloured pencil, get a wide range of colours and just go for it :) If you can't by the book, I suggest trying to mimic the expression, and see what your face does.
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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alright then, I'll try practising some expressions when I next get the chance.

I would colour digitally but the computer I use is the house computer which is so clogged up with useless junk I think any other software and it would go as slow as a snail.
I think when I get my laptop Digital colouring will be the next step, but for now, its pencils. *Sets off to see where can buy good colouring pencils*
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I haven't been slacking, I swear! Anyways... I have a picture here that I would like to get advice on.

Inspired by a photo of a friend
Spoiler:
Image

Larger Ver.


I've never been the best at shading different tones... but the hair is what irks me the most. I don't really get how to shade hair so it looks more like hair (maybe 'natural' is the wording I want...)
Right now it kind of looks liney. Should I use soft shading or more crosshatching? And how should I go by doing it?

(I'm kind of bad at explaining things... sorry if it doesn't make that much sense.)
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alynnyang wrote:
I've never been the best at shading different tones... but the hair is what irks me the most. I don't really get how to shade hair so it looks more like hair (maybe 'natural' is the wording I want...)
Right now it kind of looks liney. Should I use soft shading or more crosshatching? And how should I go by doing it?

(I'm kind of bad at explaining things... sorry if it doesn't make that much sense.)


Don't do crosshatching. Unless you know what you're doing, crosshatching is a bad idea, cause hair is lengths of straight lines- not crisscrosses. The way I do hair is I decide where the hair is coming from, and shade the dark areas with lines, and leave the bright areas mostly lineless. If your hair is a perfect shape, you can go straight to this, but if the hair is messed up or textured, it's best to simplify the clusters of hair into 'locks' and attack each lock individually. Once you've gone over it once, then you can go over it again and shade where hair is shading hair.

Spoiler: Gin Wigmore example
Image


As you see here, her hair is kind of a wavy cluster of hair, and I've separated the different sections of hair into major clusters, and haven't shaded the white ares much at all. I separate the white areas out to create depth by putting in some deep shadows between the hair. In blond hair, you want to keep the shading to a minimum.

Spoiler: Sweeney Todd example
Image


In dark or black hair, you want to shade most of the hair, and leave the highlights sharp- Hair has a glossy sheen to it, specially if it's clean. Where light hits, it'll always give off some sort of sheen, even if it's a diffused one.

Spoiler: Axel Hermann example
Image


If you want to be a little lazy/you don't want the hair to stand out, another good way of giving depth without stealing the show is by letting the texture of the pencil do the work for you. For this to work though, you have to not want the hair to be a focus, and you want an even texture over all the hair, and let the silhouette of the hair give it shape.

Tip- if you have a fine eraser (Like a retractable one), these are good for highlights. Just skim your eraser in the direction of the hair to give it a quick easy highlight. I also like smudging the area if the hair is light to give the highlight an extra kick and erase a bit fo the gloss effect. Dont over do it though.

One other thing with hair- Do long strokes with your pencil. If you can't do the entire length of hair in one easy stroke, then try to start lightly at the end of a stroke and make it 'continue'. Even with black hair it's REALLY noticeable if the strokes aren't fluid. Destroys the illusion of long hair cause it looks like it 'starts again' at a strange area on the head.

So yeah. Basically separate your hair into locks and shade in the direction of the hair. IT gets easier as you practice it, I promise :)
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@Arkillian
Thank you for that thorough explanation! It helped me a lot. I understand shading hair a lot more now.
I'll go practice when I'm done homework.
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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Random emotions ahoy!
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*Note- Expressions are heavily stylised.

I jst drew random emotions I thought of in no sort of order... Doing this helped me notice a bnit mroe how expresssions work. Laughing and yawning are so similar, i never realised!!
Crits are not nesacerry, but if you want to red line thats okay. :)

Meh...I really dont like 'In Love', looks so typical. Ugh. Oh, the ones with quotation marks is when i couldnt think fo a word to describe the emotion.
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Ah- good on you :) Keep it around and see if a visual reference helps you out for future pictures. Some expressions don't quite fall under one expression, so sometimes you need to combine the two. I'm sure you'll know when you need to do that though :) Having an understanding of facial expression is really important for establishing a relationship with the artwork thoguh.
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Heat Guy J

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There isn't exactly one singular way of drawing an expression; it just depends on how you want to make your character look. It will affect what other people think of them later though.

For drawing expressions, I recommend this sheet: http://napalmnacey.deviantart.com/art/2 ... s-55523083

If you need any advice on drawing expressions, feel free to ask. I love doing them.
Pauca sed matura.

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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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I'll start thinking about expressions more often now, and if they really match the pose. Its easy to draw a good-looking expressionless face, but its kinda boring and the picture falls flat. I
Cool, I saved that 25 expressions sheet and I'll be sure to use it when I tackle a peice of art, infact, I might give it a go later on with one of my characters.
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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UUUHHH, sorry for the double post but what can I do?

I tried to draw realisticly after the discussion Neko, arkillian and I had on Nekos art thread. It's ema, and its big. Its also very faint, because ts just a sketch as of yet.

Spoiler: big
[img=BIIG, as always]Image

I'm aware the eys are uneven...any more rubbing out and the page would DIE

Okay I want to know:
What you think so far?
How I can improve on it,
And also does it look realistic?
I'm aware it has its stylised touches, but thats just me...and if possible, what would be the best way to colour this? Or should I not colour it at all?

and any other general crits.
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A True English Diva-To-Be <3

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My main pointer would be that it's difficult to suddenly go to drawing realism from cartoon style without a reference (obviously you're unable to get a realistic reference for Ema)- I'd really recommend drawing some portraits from reference first~

This summer I decided I'd learn to draw faces realistically (something I've never been able to do) and one thing I learnt from doing this is that once you learn a few basic rules for drawing facial features, with a bit of practice, you'll be able to do it without a reference ^^

I found this site incredibly helpful- especially this tutorial on drawing the female eye.

But as the picture stands...

-I'd say the iris needs to be far bigger: unless the person is pulling a very surprised face, the iris usually vertically spans almost the whole eye (though of course it depends what facial expression you're going for)

-Instead of using heavy outlining on the lips, try focusing on the gap between them, which is always the darkest area of the mouth and drawing the actual lip line less heavily. Once again, references will help with this- the stylised image of the lips that we're used to often doesn't correlate to how the mouth really looks when drawing it :3

Anyway, that's just my horribly underqualified opinion- hope it's helpful in some way, shape or form XD
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Click on Janice for graphics ^^
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What you think so far?I'm not sure how to answer that ^^; IT's a bit of an open ended question ^^;
How I can improve on it, Well, this is your first one, right? You shoudl do a couple before you ask that. Alot of it is knowing the proportions and then asking yourself if it looks right. You wont know this till you try it a few times though. One doesn't simply step into realism (Lol- LOTR play)
And also does it look realistic? IT looks MORE realistic, but you're still very far off a true 100% realistic portrait. I wouldn't worry about getting it absolutely realistic though. My realistic style still looks very stylized to actual realism artists. The biggest thing for you right now is to to learn the proportions and practice them. I suggest practicing off photographs, not anime art. IF you post them in the crit thread, I don't mind if it's not PW art. I'll still crit :) I'd like you to try a few times first though.
I'm aware it has its stylised touches, but thats just me...and if possible, what would be the best way to colour this? Or should I not colour it at all? I wouldn't colour it unless you're specifically attached to it. You want to learn form? Learn form. Colour is a HUGE subject by itself. Learn one thing at a time cause I assure you, learning form is hard enough. I donno- find an actor you like and draw them maybe. I use to do it when I was younger too. What you want to be doing is something small an fast. Do shading while you're at it if you can, cause learning it as a lineart isn't necessarily a good thing. It forces boundaries on how you see lighting. IF you find a picture with good lighting, try to put that in too. It'll help you lay out the face and figure it out in a 3D form. It doesn't need to be any hard core. Just a sketch like this is fine:-

Spoiler: Hard core dude is hard core
Image


Do lots of sketches. Concentrate on relationship of the eyes to mouth, and nose and stuff, get some shading in, and getting an impression atleast. Don't spend more than 5 minutes on the picture. This may seem like a stress to you, but this helps non important noises in your head to shut off and focus. Make sure that you wont get interrupted so you can focus too. Try to limit yourself down further as you get use to it. Don't sweat the small stuff, just do. As soon as you can let go of what others think of your art and just do, you'll be surprised how much faster you'll learn.

Hope this helps :)

Panda has some truth in there too. See what works for you, but practice is the best advice. Practicing correctly.
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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Thanks guys, I now see the flaws you mentioned Panda. I did think the eyes were off.
And Arkillian, I'll take on that advice :notes:
I was going for the sort of cartoonized realisim, if you know what I mean? Yeah probably not...

Oh don't worry, I do enough sketches, but maybe I'll try to focus on them a bit more this time. I usually do them randomly while doing something else-I'll focus a bit more now.
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If you're trying to draw realistic faces, I recommend this site: http://portrait-artist.org/

Coloring isn't exactly a bad idea, but it's got problems of its own. Better to focus on getting the anatomy and get everything else right before you move to color. Besides, you can usually omit most of the lineart details and let the coloring do all the work for you if you're going for realism. The important part of coloring is understanding the light source, which I would say accounts for the majority of the picture anyways (and lineart falls into the same category anyways; it's just a simplified interpretation of where the shadows are. Lines are just easier for most people to follow anyways.)
Pauca sed matura.

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Jay wrote:
If you're trying to draw realistic faces, I recommend this site: http://portrait-artist.org/


That has some interesting stuff :) I agree- colouring is great to get into early, but you doesn't want to be learning too much at once. Just a change of art style is MORE than enough to battle with for afew months for me. Just get use to the style. there's no rush :)
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SMASHING DAY FOR A BARBEQUE.

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This was actaully a homework assignment, but It really turned out quite well.
It was to find a picture of a celebrity in a magazine (I did Lady Gaga if you're interested), cut their face in half and draw the other side. This really helped me understand some of my mistakes when I realized some of the things on my side didnt match up with the others (My eyes were too big, etc.). I wondered if anyone else has used this? I found it much more useful than just copying because i can compare it to the other side.

Theres still some paintwork drying in my artbook so i cant exactly close it to scan xD
But when thats dry I will show it.
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Waiting on Godot...

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Romeo wrote:
This was actaully a homework assignment, but It really turned out quite well.
It was to find a picture of a celebrity in a magazine (I did Lady Gaga if you're interested), cut their face in half and draw the other side. This really helped me understand some of my mistakes when I realized some of the things on my side didnt match up with the others (My eyes were too big, etc.).


Sorry- can you clarify what you mean? Normally what I do is that I flip the image. I find that if it looks lopsided when it's backwards then it needs fixing. if it looks right both ways then it wont be immediately offending to the viewer.
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The Hoosiers :) Just too cool.

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hiya everyone- havent been here for aaaggggeeeesss, anyways
i drew :chinami: did that cos i forget her name hhuuurrr
and im gona draw iris the other side crying, but i hope you like it so far;
all i want its crit on evrthing before i do it in pen and coluor. anyways so yh i did a link cos it was to big ^^;;didn't want to get told off by arky :3
dalhila?is it?...urk im dumb.
also its light.
my sprites Image(click the pic for pandas graphics~)
Re: Crit thread- Need any help improving your art?Topic%20Title

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It's not too bad, but the eyes need to be angled for the foreshortened angle. I'd look at some referances. The mouth needs to be angled a bit more too. Try finishing off the sketch and see how it turns out :)
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