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Re: Metal GearTopic%20Title

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Yeah, this isn't oversexualized at all.
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Well lets look at the women.

Meryl: distinctive walking style but otherwise a soldier and a tomboy, any femininity is pretty much obliterated by MGS4.

Sniper Wolf: Bit revealing and sultry but nothing bordering on the likes of DOA. Still portrayed as a strong confident character.

Emma: Not really oversexualised at all just portrayed as a regular girl.

Olga: Dresses like a boy and then....well spoilers but in neither of her appearances is she especially sexualised.

Fortune: Yeah her legs are on show but her chest is completely covered so bit of both.

Naomi: The characters act as if she's an especially attractive character but...well she dresses just like a scientist so her design isn't inherently sexist.

Mei Ling: Shown in full uniform in any appearance, not an especially sexy uniform but a proper uniform.

Rose: Shown wearing a thick sweater and wearing just regular clothes...not really sexualised.

Eva: Actually went to a school of seduction in her own words so when in her own clothes she does act sexualised (which makes sense in the plot considering her motives regarding BB) but when in her disguise on Volgin's base she isn't especially sexualised.

The Boss/Joy: Hardly sexualised since she's often shown in uncomfortable looking military gear that looks arguably proper.

Paramedic: We hardly see but she just looks like a radio operator from what we do know.

The B&B Corps are distinctively sexualised, and I'm not sure why though considering how they were originally meant to be naked in those suits and he based their appearance off real models I'm sure there's some plot reason I'm missing for their behaviour. Perhaps it's simply so the 'beauty and the beast' tagline worked for them as a unit because they are most definitely not sexy in their suits.


There's the issue of the random posters of women kicking about the locker rooms and canteens where you go but eh they are professional models. As for how the series portrays it's own characters I wouldn't say it's especially bad.
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So...I...I just heard the English Trailer for Ground Zeros...the same footage as the Japanese one with "Here's to you" and XOF all over the place.

And...I just don't know if I can bear it guys...

:sob: Kiefer Sutherland did a bad job...he just sounds like himself...not like Snake not even like an old war vet. :sob:

Despite a lifetime of smoking cigars, getting blown up, bench pressing tanks, hunting monsters, going through agonising battles and betrayals the new voice sounds LESS gruff and battered and bitter.

For a while I'd forgotten the content of the original trailer and thought "Hmm that sounds a little like Raiden" then I remembered with horror it was Snake who was speaking those lines.

Geez man...I had hoped it wouldn't be this bad.
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Re: Metal GearTopic%20Title

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Pierre wrote:
So...I...I just heard the English Trailer for Ground Zeros...the same footage as the Japanese one with "Here's to you" and XOF all over the place.

And...I just don't know if I can bear it guys...

:sob: Kiefer Sutherland did a bad job...he just sounds like himself...not like Snake not even like an old war vet. :sob:

Despite a lifetime of smoking cigars, getting blown up, bench pressing tanks, hunting monsters, going through agonising battles and betrayals the new voice sounds LESS gruff and battered and bitter.

For a while I'd forgotten the content of the original trailer and thought "Hmm that sounds a little like Raiden" then I remembered with horror it was Snake who was speaking those lines.

Geez man...I had hoped it wouldn't be this bad.


I don't see why people are complaining. Out of all the terrible acting out there, you're honestly saying that Kiefer Sutherland is bad? Come on! He's a good actor! And I feel that he did an admirable job of Snake. That trailer gives him like four lines, so it's not a very good demonstration.

The only reason people don't like him is because he isn't David Hayter. I really wish that Hayter would come back too, but what's done is done. What's really bothering me is how Konami and Kojima seem to be treating the whole situation. Kojima himself has basically dodged all questions relating to him, stating that it all has to do with the motion capture technology. Fair enough, but how come you've kept all the other actors? How come for the Japanese dub, you're keeping the same people? Apparently, David Hayter was so angry; he's stated that he has no plans to play MGSV when it eventually comes out.

But ignoring all of that, I think that Sutherland is fine. It could have been a whole lot worse, trust me. Plus, will the decision to replace the main voice actor really ruin the game? From what's been shown and talked about, MGSV will change video games as we know it.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
So...I...I just heard the English Trailer for Ground Zeros...the same footage as the Japanese one with "Here's to you" and XOF all over the place.

And...I just don't know if I can bear it guys...

:sob: Kiefer Sutherland did a bad job...he just sounds like himself...not like Snake not even like an old war vet. :sob:

Despite a lifetime of smoking cigars, getting blown up, bench pressing tanks, hunting monsters, going through agonising battles and betrayals the new voice sounds LESS gruff and battered and bitter.

For a while I'd forgotten the content of the original trailer and thought "Hmm that sounds a little like Raiden" then I remembered with horror it was Snake who was speaking those lines.

Geez man...I had hoped it wouldn't be this bad.


I don't see why people are complaining. Out of all the terrible acting out there, you're honestly saying that Kiefer Sutherland is bad? Come on! He's a good actor! And I feel that he did an admirable job of Snake. That trailer gives him like four lines, so it's not a very good demonstration.

The only reason people don't like him is because he isn't David Hayter. I really wish that Hayter would come back too, but what's done is done. What's really bothering me is how Konami and Kojima seem to be treating the whole situation. Kojima himself has basically dodged all questions relating to him, stating that it all has to do with the motion capture technology. Fair enough, but how come you've kept all the other actors? How come for the Japanese dub, you're keeping the same people? Apparently, David Hayter was so angry; he's stated that he has no plans to play MGSV when it eventually comes out.

But ignoring all of that, I think that Sutherland is fine. It could have been a whole lot worse, trust me. Plus, will the decision to replace the main voice actor really ruin the game? From what's been shown and talked about, MGSV will change video games as we know it.


I dunno man, I'm not looking for a great actor, I'm looking for Snake. When I hear Sutherland do Snake it didn't sound like he was trying in anyway, like he thought his own voice was good enough. I think people are donning rose-tinted goggles because they like Sutherland in other things but it's really not a good dub for it.

An yeah I think there's something REALLY shady going down with keeping Hayter out of the situation as well. Like perhaps some kind of bust up between him and Konami since it just really doesn't make sense like you said.

Also even Raiden has thrown in his support saying he wants Hayter for it.

Though at the point where Sutherland is being used for trailers I don't think any petition will sort it.
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Re: Metal GearTopic%20Title

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Quote:
I dunno man, I'm not looking for a great actor, I'm looking for Snake. When I hear Sutherland do Snake it didn't sound like he was trying in anyway, like he thought his own voice was good enough. I think people are donning rose-tinted goggles because they like Sutherland in other things but it's really not a good dub for it.

An yeah I think there's something REALLY shady going down with keeping Hayter out of the situation as well. Like perhaps some kind of bust up between him and Konami since it just really doesn't make sense like you said.

Also even Raiden has thrown in his support saying he wants Hayter for it.

Though at the point where Sutherland is being used for trailers I don't think any petition will sort it.


You and I are just used to David Hayter, and it's jarring to hear someone else's voice after all these years. Solid Snake was originally inspired by 80s action heroes, and I'm getting similar vibes from Sutherland. Personally for me, I think he's absolutely fine.

Perhaps Hayter IS in MGSV, but not as Big Boss. Solid Snake is about 12 years old during the time period of the game, but that doesn't mean he won't appear as an adult in some shape or form. Maybe Big Boss will cross paths with Snake, and the ending will jump forward a few years and tie in with the original Metal Gear. Basically, my theory is that Big Boss and Solid Snake will meet each other, with Sutherland as Naked and Hayter as Solid.

Also for the Legacy Collection, it comes with a Digital Comic that's fully voiced in English. There are several lines that aren't in the games, and I'm pretty sure the thing was recorded from scratch. So David Hayter had to have at least came back for that. I don't think Konami and him are done forever. However, it's way too late in the game to even consider replacing Sutherland with Hayter. That ship has already sailed.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Quote:
I dunno man, I'm not looking for a great actor, I'm looking for Snake. When I hear Sutherland do Snake it didn't sound like he was trying in anyway, like he thought his own voice was good enough. I think people are donning rose-tinted goggles because they like Sutherland in other things but it's really not a good dub for it.

An yeah I think there's something REALLY shady going down with keeping Hayter out of the situation as well. Like perhaps some kind of bust up between him and Konami since it just really doesn't make sense like you said.

Also even Raiden has thrown in his support saying he wants Hayter for it.

Though at the point where Sutherland is being used for trailers I don't think any petition will sort it.


You and I are just used to David Hayter, and it's jarring to hear someone else's voice after all these years. Solid Snake was originally inspired by 80s action heroes, and I'm getting similar vibes from Sutherland. Personally for me, I think he's absolutely fine.

Perhaps Hayter IS in MGSV, but not as Big Boss. Solid Snake is about 12 years old during the time period of the game, but that doesn't mean he won't appear as an adult in some shape or form. Maybe Big Boss will cross paths with Snake, and the ending will jump forward a few years and tie in with the original Metal Gear. Basically, my theory is that Big Boss and Solid Snake will meet each other, with Sutherland as Naked and Hayter as Solid.

Also for the Legacy Collection, it comes with a Digital Comic that's fully voiced in English. There are several lines that aren't in the games, and I'm pretty sure the thing was recorded from scratch. So David Hayter had to have at least came back for that. I don't think Konami and him are done forever. However, it's way too late in the game to even consider replacing Sutherland with Hayter. That ship has already sailed.


During the Twin Snakes they had to call back all the other voice actors to do new lines instead of just using the old recordings, Hayter took it out of his own pay to bring them back...he truly loves the series, it's just weird to think how harshly they'd treat him after all his years.

Also 12 year old Solid Snake? An why not Richard Doyle who voiced Big Boss in MGS4? It's not just it's not Snake I don't think Sutherland even sounds much like an old vet or an old 80's hero. Kurt Russell's voice, he's iconic for me something like that is closer to what I think would be acceptable.
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Did you guys hear that they've announced a release window for Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes? It's going to be separate from the main Phantom Pain portion set for release on PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, and Xbox One for Spring 2014.
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/11/04/ ... lease-date

The game will be available in both a physical package and as a download. The physical release for Xbox 360 and PS3 will cost $30 while the digital will cost $20. The next-gen versions so far have only been confirmed for digital and will set you back $30.

Any thoughts on this?
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Is there any confirmed content differences between this gen and next gen versions? Or is it purely aesthetics.
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Pierre wrote:
Is there any confirmed content differences between this gen and next gen versions? Or is it purely aesthetics.


Nothing yet. But Kojima has stated that MGSV was made specifically for current-gen. The Fox Engine has been in development ever since MGS4, so dev kits for next-gen didn't even exist back then. I'm guessing that the next-gen versions will just look slightly better. As will all of the ports of current gen games for PS4 and Xbox One.
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Have they mentioned why the digital version is cheaper?
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D.A. McCoy wrote:
Have they mentioned why the digital version is cheaper?


No, but it's likely because it doesn't require any shipping or manufacturing costs. The next-gen versions don't even have a physical release. That just shows you that digital is the way of the future. As for me, I'm buying a physical copy of the Xbox 360 version. It'll likely be a day one purchase for me.

BTW, did you ever finish MGS2?
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
D.A. McCoy wrote:
Have they mentioned why the digital version is cheaper?


No, but it's likely because it doesn't require any shipping or manufacturing costs. The next-gen versions don't even have a physical release. That just shows you that digital is the way of the future. As for me, I'm buying a physical copy of the Xbox 360 version. It'll likely be a day one purchase for me.

BTW, did you ever finish MGS2?


Not yet. I'm in college hours away from my house, and my sister and I always play the games together since she's a big Metal Gear fan. She likes to watch me play rather than play herself, so it's kind of a group activity, and we keep getting distracted with other games. But it's almost fall break for me, so it's top on my list to play (along with DD) when I get home.
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Quote:
Not yet. I'm in college hours away from my house, and my sister and I always play the games together since she's a big Metal Gear fan. She likes to watch me play rather than play herself, so it's kind of a group activity, and we keep getting distracted with other games. But it's almost fall break for me, so it's top on my list to play (along with DD) when I get home.


Well there's no other game series to "watch" other than Metal Gear. Do you have the HD or Legacy Collection? MGS3 is also on 3DS.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
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Not yet. I'm in college hours away from my house, and my sister and I always play the games together since she's a big Metal Gear fan. She likes to watch me play rather than play herself, so it's kind of a group activity, and we keep getting distracted with other games. But it's almost fall break for me, so it's top on my list to play (along with DD) when I get home.


Well there's no other game series to "watch" other than Metal Gear. Do you have the HD or Legacy Collection? MGS3 is also on 3DS.


I own the HD Collection. I got into metal gear through Snake Eater 3DS but I traded it when I got the HD Collection.

I thought about getting the Legacy collection, but I already own MGS4 and Twin Snakes, so it didn't give me really anything new.

Yeah I love how cinematic Metal Gear is; as a cinema major and fan of old-school point-and-click games (which featured long cutscenes) I always liked the cutscenes in the games. We got distracted playing Bioshock Infinite for a while, and then we got caught up playing Majora's Mask for a bit, but I'm planning on finishing MGS2 when I go home for Thanksgiving.
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Quote:
I own the HD Collection. I got into metal gear through Snake Eater 3DS but I traded it when I got the HD Collection.

I thought about getting the Legacy collection, but I already own MGS4 and Twin Snakes, so it didn't give me really anything new.

Yeah I love how cinematic Metal Gear is; as a cinema major and fan of old-school point-and-click games (which featured long cutscenes) I always liked the cutscenes in the games. We got distracted playing Bioshock Infinite for a while, and then we got caught up playing Majora's Mask for a bit, but I'm planning on finishing MGS2 when I go home for Thanksgiving.


I've been playing BioShock Infinite too and I think I'm getting close to the final areas. It's definitely my game of the year so far. The story, graphics, and refined FPS gameplay make this one even better than the original.

If you like cinema and point-and-click adventure games, I highly, highly recommend Hideo Kojima's non-Metal Gear games Snatcher and Policenauts. If you want more details on these, just check Page 2 of this thread since I've already explained them. These were made in the 1990s, yet Kojima was already years ahead of his time with video game storytelling. Snatcher is playable on a Sega CD emulator (it's the only version in English and the best version too), while Policenauts can be played on a PS1 emulator patched in English with an excellent fan translation.

If there's one thing that Hideo Kojima excels at, it's his homages to classic cinema. Metal Gear was heavily inspired by the Great Escape, The Guns of Navarone, Full Metal Jacket, James Bond, Alfred Hitchock, and tons of other films. Snatcher is based upon Blade Runner and Akira, while the newer MGS games take inspiration from action flms like Jason Bourne.

I hope you'll enjoy the series when you eventually get to the end. Make sure you play them all in order. The storyline's very important. :jake:
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
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I own the HD Collection. I got into metal gear through Snake Eater 3DS but I traded it when I got the HD Collection.

I thought about getting the Legacy collection, but I already own MGS4 and Twin Snakes, so it didn't give me really anything new.

Yeah I love how cinematic Metal Gear is; as a cinema major and fan of old-school point-and-click games (which featured long cutscenes) I always liked the cutscenes in the games. We got distracted playing Bioshock Infinite for a while, and then we got caught up playing Majora's Mask for a bit, but I'm planning on finishing MGS2 when I go home for Thanksgiving.


I've been playing BioShock Infinite too and I think I'm getting close to the final areas. It's definitely my game of the year so far. The story, graphics, and refined FPS gameplay make this one even better than the original.

If you like cinema and point-and-click adventure games, I highly, highly recommend Hideo Kojima's non-Metal Gear games Snatcher and Policenauts. If you want more details on these, just check Page 2 of this thread since I've already explained them. These were made in the 1990s, yet Kojima was already years ahead of his time with video game storytelling. Snatcher is playable on a Sega CD emulator (it's the only version in English and the best version too), while Policenauts can be played on a PS1 emulator patched in English with an excellent fan translation.

If there's one thing that Hideo Kojima excels at, it's his homages to classic cinema. Metal Gear was heavily inspired by the Great Escape, The Guns of Navarone, Full Metal Jacket, James Bond, Alfred Hitchock, and tons of other films. Snatcher is based upon Blade Runner and Akira, while the newer MGS games take inspiration from action flms like Jason Bourne.

I hope you'll enjoy the series when you eventually get to the end. Make sure you play them all in order. The storyline's very important. :jake:


I'm playing them in like half-chronological, half-release date order, since neither seemed totally perfect for a fan getting into it late. So basically its:

Metal Gear -> Metal Gear II: Solid Snake -> Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes -> Metal Gear Solid 2: Guns of the Patriots -> Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater -> Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops -> Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker -> Metal Gear Solid: Ground Zeroes -> Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain -> Metal Gear Solid IV: Guns of the Patriots
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Uh Portable Ops...that one is a slog to finish I found.
Though I did love the heavy James Bond influences in MGS3, all in all I think it's probably my favourite game of that generation.

Though why play MGSIV after MGSV?
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Pierre wrote:
Uh Portable Ops...that one is a slog to finish I found.
Though I did love the heavy James Bond influences in MGS3, all in all I think it's probably my favourite game of that generation.

Though why play MGSIV after MGSV?


I can't play Portable Ops because I don't have a PSP. Though I did play Peace Walker on Xbox 360. I actually haven't beaten it yet despite having it for almost two years. The extra ops with the tanks and choppers are really difficult. They recently announced that a complete version of Metal Gear Rising is coming out for only $30 with all the DLC included, so I'm probably going to pick up that. I can't play MGS4 because I don't have a PS3, but I saw a longplay of it years ago.

Doesn't really matter. MGS4 comes after MGSV, so it's alright. Metal Gear Rising is technically the last one though.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Uh Portable Ops...that one is a slog to finish I found.
Though I did love the heavy James Bond influences in MGS3, all in all I think it's probably my favourite game of that generation.

Though why play MGSIV after MGSV?


I can't play Portable Ops because I don't have a PSP. Though I did play Peace Walker on Xbox 360. I actually haven't beaten it yet despite having it for almost two years. The extra ops with the tanks and choppers are really difficult. They recently announced that a complete version of Metal Gear Rising is coming out for only $30 with all the DLC included, so I'm probably going to pick up that. I can't play MGS4 because I don't have a PS3, but I saw a longplay of it years ago.

Doesn't really matter. MGS4 comes after MGSV, so it's alright. Metal Gear Rising is technically the last one though.


Yes but knowing how intertwining Metal Gear is I wouldn't put it past getting somehow spoilerish information about MGSIV in MGSV even though chronologically that should make no sense.

Kojima has ways....
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Quote:
Yes but knowing how intertwining Metal Gear is I wouldn't put it past getting somehow spoilerish information about MGSIV in MGSV even though chronologically that should make no sense.

Kojima has ways....


As far as I know, Peace Walker doesn't make any references to MGS4 other than a few songs on the Walkman, does it?
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
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Yes but knowing how intertwining Metal Gear is I wouldn't put it past getting somehow spoilerish information about MGSIV in MGSV even though chronologically that should make no sense.

Kojima has ways....


As far as I know, Peace Walker doesn't make any references to MGS4 other than a few songs on the Walkman, does it?


Nope true, I guess I'm just paranoid about spoilers.
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I honestly hope that I get to play MGS4 one day. Kojima says that an Xbox 360 version would take "up to seven discs," but that's only because the game uses uncompressed audio which takes the bulk of storage space. ALL GAMES usually have some kind of compression and there's clearly demand for an Xbox 360 port. Hell, they've shown it working on Vita at an acceptable frame rate. It can be done.

Oh well. At least I've got MGSV to look forward to.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
I honestly hope that I get to play MGS4 one day. Kojima says that an Xbox 360 version would take "up to seven discs," but that's only because the game uses uncompressed audio which takes the bulk of storage space. ALL GAMES usually have some kind of compression and there's clearly demand for an Xbox 360 port. Hell, they've shown it working on Vita at an acceptable frame rate. It can be done.

Oh well. At least I've got MGSV to look forward to.


Yeah that always seemed like BS to me. Couldn't they just release it on Xbox Live if they really were worried about physical release production costs/the number of discs?

I'm playing MGSIV after all the others because from what I've read it really is a series finale. It would seem a little anti-climatic to play MGSV after everything has been wrapped up in MGSIV. The level of violence in Metal Gear Rising is a little too much for me personally, but I might still play it. Not sure yet.
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Hmm..it's more I heard Sony shelled out a fortunate to keep it as an exclusive. I mean you might already know this but in game you get a little 'mini metal gear' you can roll around for reconnaissance and shock people with. It's remote control? A PS4 controller.

They also did the same thing in Peace Walker where you have a Sony Walkman as your music player.
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Pierre wrote:
Hmm..it's more I heard Sony shelled out a fortunate to keep it as an exclusive. I mean you might already know this but in game you get a little 'mini metal gear' you can roll around for reconnaissance and shock people with. It's remote control? A PS4 controller.

They also did the same thing in Peace Walker where you have a Sony Walkman as your music player.


But the Walkman and all the Sony references still are in the Xbox 360 version of Peace Walker. You know what would be great? A Wii U port of MGS4. The tablet is perfectly suited for it and the Wii U Game Discs are dual layered and hold 50 GB, just like PS3.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Hmm..it's more I heard Sony shelled out a fortunate to keep it as an exclusive. I mean you might already know this but in game you get a little 'mini metal gear' you can roll around for reconnaissance and shock people with. It's remote control? A PS4 controller.

They also did the same thing in Peace Walker where you have a Sony Walkman as your music player.


But the Walkman and all the Sony references still are in the Xbox 360 version of Peace Walker. You know what would be great? A Wii U port of MGS4. The tablet is perfectly suited for it and the Wii U Game Discs are dual layered and hold 50 GB, just like PS3.


If they made a Wii U version of the Legacy Collection (with HD Versions of the Twin Snakes [they could do that since its a Nintendo console], MGS2 HD, MGS3 HD, A port of Portable Ops, Peace Walker HD, and MGSIV) I would totally buy it. The touchscreen menu controls/map in MGS3 3DS was awesome.
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Did anyone see the news about the PS3 and PS4 version of Ground Zeroes getting an exclusive mission called "Deja Vu" in the style of the original Metal Gear Solid?

The Xbox 360 and Xbox One versions are apparently getting their own exclusive content too, but it hasn't been revealed yet.

They've also shown the Japanese box art along with several collector's editions. I hope we Westerners get some kind of bundle too.
http://kotaku.com/so-many-different-met ... 1465027877

Interestingly, Kojima's admitted that MGSV's story will have inconsistencies in comparison to the already established canon of the series. I wonder how that's going to turn out.
http://kotaku.com/metal-gear-solid-v-mi ... 1462498245
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Tophat you there? Get out here.

I'm having major moral qualms about the choices in MGS: Ground Zeroes.
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Pierre wrote:
Tophat you there? Get out here.

I'm having major moral qualms about the choices in MGS: Ground Zeroes.


Spoiler:
I supposed you're talking about the rape scene and graphic violence?
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Tophat you there? Get out here.

I'm having major moral qualms about the choices in MGS: Ground Zeroes.


Spoiler:
I supposed you're talking about the rape scene and graphic violence?


Spoiler:
Well while I wouldn't call it a 'scene' and the graphic violence I thought was hardly graphic what with it being audio tapes and all but yeah. I was spoiled on the content of Chico's tape 4 by...well articles all over the internet in outrage by it. I kept saying "Nah it can't be that bad, why would it?" and then sure enough heavily implied rape. Now I'm onto the big deliberation everyone seems to have, whether it was too far as far as showing extreme prisoner abuse goes. I keep going back and forth over the fence.

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Spoiler:
The graphic scene I was referring to was the ending sequence with Paz. I found the in-game violence to be greater than previous Metal Gear games even. There's way more blood when you shoot with lethal weapons, plus it appears on the "camera." Truth be told though, I actually haven't listened to the tape yet. I'm currently re-playing the main mission to get it. I'll let you know my thoughts on the infamous "rape tape" soon.
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TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Spoiler:
The graphic scene I was referring to was the ending sequence with Paz. I found the in-game violence to be greater than previous Metal Gear games even. There's way more blood when you shoot with lethal weapons, plus it appears on the "camera." Truth be told though, I actually haven't listened to the tape yet. I'm currently re-playing the main mission to get it. I'll let you know my thoughts on the infamous "rape tape" soon.


Spoiler:
Indeed, you need to save the escaped prisoner to unlock it I think. It's actually the rest of the tape's contents that make me feel compelled to think it is a necessary inclusion. Though I suppose the bomb removal scene is pretty graphic but I just took it as them wanting to go down a grittier angle than in the past. The blood from lethal weapons I'll admit I've hardly even noticed.

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Anyways while I've been playing Ground Zeroes, I've finally been able to publish my Metal Gear MSX adaptions officially online. The first part is here if you're interested in reading it.
http://thepunkeffect.com/?p=14748

So far there's three parts published, and the fourth part will conclude the story of the first Metal Gear game. The following parts that I post will adapt Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake. Practically everything is already written, in fact it has been for years, but it's in need of substantial editing. I've gotten a bit lazy in posting new chapters, but they're coming soon.

I explain the concept behind these stories in the link I provided, but I'm basically writing these for the people who haven't played these older games or are completely new to the series. I also wanted to expand upon the relationship with Solid Snake and Big Boss since we don't really see that in the games. I just hope that the Phantom Pain won't contradict anything. :udgey:
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After like a year of forgetting to go back to it, I finally got back to playing Metal Gear again.

I was so lost after a year of not progressing in my save file of MGS2 that I just decided to skip to MGS3, considering Big Boss is the focus right now. I completed it in about a week; I'm planning on playing through Peace Walker and Ground Zeroes during Christmas break. (I'll be playing MGS2 after the Big Boss arc)

I was concerned about the content of GZ
Spoiler:
(specifically the rape audio and the bomb scene)
but after refreshing myself on the Phantom Pain trailer, suddenly GZ looks tame
Spoiler:
considering the trailers for TPP has dead children being eaten by buzzards, Ocelot torturing Quiet and Huey, Big Boss shooting helpless prisoners in a cage, another soldier shooting a prisoner graphically, another soldier strangling Quiet (which makes me more worried about rumors I've heard about Quiet being a rape victim), Big Boss walking around the dead bodies, covered in blood, etc.
I understand that Big Boss will become a villain in this game; I didn't think that it would be a "fun" experience from a story perspective, but I'm not super confident that Kojima knows how to deal with these subjects the way they need to be in order to be warranted. I really like the MGS series, but part of it has always been that things are over the top. Considering the severity and disturbing nature of these subjects, I worry that they'll be used for shock value rather than because they needed to be.

Spoiler:
I can see where things like Ocelot torturing people or Big Boss killing his own soldiers have their place in the game, considering Ocelot's progression to the character we see in MGS1, so in those cases the duration/intensity will be a huge factor in determining how important or gratuitous those scenes actually were for the narrative. But scenes like the dead village or Big Boss killing prisoners seem to me to simply be shock value; they could portray that scene with less actual gore and it would still have the same intended effect. (I understand it may be lessened, but for me seeing that gives me an intense enough effect to want to stop playing, which I doubt is the effect Kojima wants.) I guess what I'm saying is that I feel like there's a point where as a creator of an entertainment medium, you can put so much emphasis on your point (in this case, Big Boss' transformation to villain, or the horrors of war, etc.) that you make the product too painful to be entertaining anymore and the player's thoughts switch from "Oh man, that's a terrible thing that Big Boss did" to "Oh man, why did the game get that graphic? I don't even want to play anymore". I think games suffer from this more as a result of the interactive nature of the medium.

I'm still interested in this game, but I might wait until after release to see if the general opinion is that it made its points well or if these things were just added for shock value.

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I'm not sure, Big Boss' arc has always been more serious than the standard Metal Gear fare for me. Mostly because...well he has a lot of breaking to go through in order for him to become an eventual villain.

Plus War atrocities do occur after all, I don't think 'shock value' applies when a recurring theme for Big Boss is his "fall from grace" and how he's becoming an increasing monster as a legendary mercenary and soldier and grows more embittered to the world. If the game wasn't set out to show "War is hell" then yeah I'd say maybe it's for shock value but as it is I think Kojima is just trying something a little different.
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Pierre wrote:
I'm not sure, Big Boss' arc has always been more serious than the standard Metal Gear fare for me. Mostly because...well he has a lot of breaking to go through in order for him to become an eventual villain.

Plus War atrocities do occur after all, I don't think 'shock value' applies when a recurring theme for Big Boss is his "fall from grace" and how he's becoming an increasing monster as a legendary mercenary and soldier and grows more embittered to the world. If the game wasn't set out to show "War is hell" then yeah I'd say maybe it's for shock value but as it is I think Kojima is just trying something a little different.


Spoiler:
I see what you're saying, and I'm not saying I'd want a game that deals with this stuff to have the more light-hearted (not really light-hearted but not nearly as dark as V) tone of MGS1 or something that's going to trivialize the issue. But from what I've heard (again, won't get to play the game until January so I've only been able to read things) the Rape and Bomb Extraction stuff was portrayed in a way that many seemed to think was unwarranted and was purely for shock value. From what I've heard, the rape specifically was used as a motivation to hate Skullface; to make him just seem like the worst guy to ever live. It wasn't making a point about rape, it was only using it as a plot point to make the player want to kill Skullface. (That's what I've heard). So it's not that I think these things shouldn't be discussed in a game, it's just that I'm not sure if I have faith that they will be done in a way that focuses on how wrong an issue is rather than simply using these issues as a plot point/objective/shock value.

I will give Kojima credit, though, none of these sequences (regarding Big Boss' actions) seem to be interactive, gameplay sequences. By not forcing the players themselves to doing this, the issues at least aren't becoming gameplay sequences that can be ignored or simplified to a simple objective. It will probably also bring some disconnect between a player and Big Boss, which would help tie into how he will transition from the playable protagonist to an NPC antagonist.

So all in all, it isn't that I have a real moral problem with the game or that I don't think these things should be brought up. I'm conflicted in 2 ways: the first is that the subject matter just might not be something that I want to go through in a game. That's just personal to me and has no bearing on the game itself. It's the equivalent of me not wanting to watch a movie dealing with this stuff. So I don't see that as a criticism of the game. The second way is what I'm talking about regarding how the subjects are being portrayed. If these subjects are things that Kojima is focusing on as the main themes of MGSV, and that he shows us how these things are wrong and the real effect of them on the world, then great. If they're just things touched upon in order to make the world depressing so Big Boss can go bad, and the game isn't really commenting on them beyond "Look how terrible this is", then that might be more concerning to me. If the rape in GZ was put in the game in order to deal with the issue, to show the aftermath of it and how it affected Paz, Chico, etc. then I'd be more inclined to believe it was warranted. But Big Boss and Kaz's opinion and attitudes towards Paz (Haven't played GZ or PW but I know she's a double agent and from what I've heard they don't particularly treat her kindly in GZ, meaning that she is still considered an antagonist to the players) combined with the whole bomb thing mean that the issue of rape isn't actually discussed, and the rape simply becomes a way of showing how bad Skullface is. That could have been accomplished without the rape scene in my opinion, especially since it was an optional tape. Again, though, I haven't played it myself. I might find everything is done well in the game. I'll come back to this once I've beaten GZ.

I'll still play TPP, and will likely enjoy a lot of it, but I'd love to get into TPP and think "Wow, I've never seen a game that brings up these things and actually discusses them in a valuable way before now". I'm just unsure if that will happen or not.
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Finished The Phantom Pain not too long ago. This is without a doubt the best Metal Gear game as far as the gameplay goes. I love just how fluid everything is. Really, the only things I have to complain about as far as gameplay goes are how stupidly difficult it can be to climb over rocks; the fact that if you don't change your company logo to feature the butterfly emblem shortly have mission 40 or so, you can permenantly lose one of your buddies; and ever since the most recent update, you'll have resources allocated as "offline" or "online." I'm not sure what decides where your already obtained resources go, but the "online" resources are only accessible while online, meaning if you aren't careful, you can accidentally go in the red if you try to play the game when you can't connect to the server for whatever reason.

As for the story, it's okay. I mean, the last great Metal Gear story was Snake Eater. Guns of the Patriots was an absolute mess, while Peace Walker was just okay. My main complaints is that while 4 was more movie than game, this almost goes too far in the other direction. There are relatively few cutscenes in the game, and a good deal of important detail gets relegated to optional cassette tape conversations (the replacement for mandatory codec conversations here). What bugs me most about this is that Keifer Sutherland's voice is almost wasted on this game because he hardly ever talks. He sounds pretty good when he actually has dialogue, but they might as well have kept David Hayter with how little dialogue he had.

Regarding the ending...
Spoiler:
The twist that Venom Snake is actually the medic from Ground Zeroes was kind of meh. I don't really care either way. However, if you take it to mean that the medic is actually the player, supported by you choosing his name and face, and having just as much claim to the title "Big Boss" as Naked Snake does, it's actually kind of a neat little meta-twist. It would also explain the Ishmael/Ahab thing in the beginning. In Moby Dick, Ahab was the main character, while the story was told from Ishmael's POV. Ishmael's almost completely absent from this game, so on the surface, it doesn't seem to make sense, but if you think of Ahab as the player, then it's always been our story told from Naked Snake's perspective up until now,


So, all in all, I'd say TPP is a great addition to the series. Personally, I'm hoping for an expanded remake of Metal Gear and Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake done in the Fox Engine next, but that's just kind of wishful thinking.
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Wasted? Try "Not good enough".

I don't buy their crap about "mo-capping the face". They kept the same Japanese voice actor just dubbed over the original.
If Hayter had been here it would have been "wasted". Big Boss (and most metal gear characters really) have always been battlefield philosophers, not passive goons who just listen.
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Don't get me wrong, I prefer Hayter too, I'm just saying that considering how Sutherland was supposedly an "upgrade," there was so little dialogue that it really wasn't worth the change.

That said, if they release a Hayter voice pack that redubs all of Snake's lines with Hayter's voice, I'm totally buying it.
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