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Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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This is a general discussion thread for episode two of the Ace Attorney anime, "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial".


Summary wrote:
When his mentor Mia Fey is murdered and the only culprit appears to be her younger sister Maya, Phoenix does what he can to see that she gets a proper defense. Meanwhile, we're introduced to genius prosecutor Miles Edgeworth, a man described as willing to do anything to win a "guilty" verdict.

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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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For those interested: Takumi's thoughts on the episode.
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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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I am starting to think they lack a consistency checker. It's nice that they want to show Edgeworth's office. But they need to remember when he got those objects they are showing off. Hint: it's way after this episode in the games.

And what's up with the episode name? "1st trial"? We don't even get the opening statement!
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henke37 wrote:
I am starting to think they lack a consistency checker. It's nice that they want to show Edgeworth's office. But they need to remember when he got those objects they are showing off. Hint: it's way after this episode in the games.

And what's up with the episode name? "1st trial"? We don't even get the opening statement!


They have Takumi HIMSELF overseeing proceedings - so...uh...it's sorta just likely they're going to reinterpret some elements here.
That being said, I liked the ep....it tugged on the heartstrings and felt very enjoyable in its execution.
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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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henke37 wrote:
I am starting to think they lack a consistency checker. It's nice that they want to show Edgeworth's office. But they need to remember when he got those objects they are showing off. Hint: it's way after this episode in the games.

I see people making this kind of comment everywhere, but I don't see the point.
We've already seen them taking liberties plenty of times. Who's to say they won't justify why these things are different down the line? And even if they don't, all's well so long as they don't contradict themselves.
If we ever found out the steel samurai figurine had been gifted by Oldbag, that'd be a contradiction. If the King of Prosecutors trophy were connected to the 5th case (assuming it'll get adapted), that'd be a contradiction.

Personally, I'm fine with all these references so long as the anime plot works. It's obviously going to have some deviations as we've already seen, all they have to do is make it work.


It seems instead of "part 1", "part 2" and so on, they use "1st Trial", "2nd Trial" and so on.
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henke37 wrote:
I am starting to think they lack a consistency checker. It's nice that they want to show Edgeworth's office. But they need to remember when he got those objects they are showing off. Hint: it's way after this episode in the games.


Well, considering the date of the first trial wasn't August as it was in the game and Phoenix doesn't even meet April May in the anime, they've probably just redone certain things either for pacing, to make references, or just whatever reason.

I doubt RFTA is going to be a part of the anime, anyway. Beyond some sort of bonus OVA.

Regarding the episode, I enjoyed it. Not much else to say. Much better than the last episode, even though it was simply an investigation chapter.
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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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My response to edgeworth already having the king of prosecutors award: [url][url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_hUZEuSGA4[/url][/url]

Also Maya has an ear piercing high pitched voice jesus christ.
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Episode 2 was actually pretty good. I was impressed. Much better than the first.

To get the bad stuff out of the way, the animation is still really bad (though I like some of the little details they put in here and there), the posing was more awkward that the last episode and the models are rougher, backgrounds are also worse than last episode. I don't expect it to get any better though, so whatever. The low quality is here to stay. I can get over that.

One change story wise I thought was kind of a bad one was relating to Maya's phone. Nick just... finds it in the Charlie's plant pot? How did the police not find that? A team of investigators and no one noticed it? Sounds very, very far fetched to me. While I don't think Gumshoe giving it up sounds very believable either, at least it makes more sense than the police not finding it at all.

Aside from those problems I have I think everything else is fine. The music is integrated better, the pacing and the way the events were told were much less awkward than in the first episode, and some of the details in the animation really surprised me, even though they were really minuscule, for one, the fact that people were walking around in the city was a surprise, even some good looking anime don't get that part. Not only that but they also react to when Nick does unusual things, which was also a really neat detail. Also Maya fiddling with the rubber band thing on her phone (can't remember what they are called oh dear) was a detail that not many low budget shows like this would go out of their way to put in.

Much better than the last episode, my faith in the series has been restored greatly. :maya:

7/10
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I lol'd when they were mourning Mia's death to the Steel Samurai theme.
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RoyalTanki wrote:
One change story wise I thought was kind of a bad one was relating to Maya's phone. Nick just... finds it in the Charlie's plant pot? How did the police not find that? A team of investigators and no one noticed it? Sounds very, very far fetched to me. While I don't think Gumshoe giving it up sounds very believable either, at least it makes more sense than the police not finding it at all.

Well, both situations are entirely possible given the police force we're talking about, but this was my line of thinking.
That first night a preliminary investigation surrounding the body took place, they made an arrest and packed in for the night, continuing the next day. The next morning we see Phoenix getting there before the police, and later on we see them all combing the place through April May's hotel window.
I find it fairly possible the police force might have neglected a thorough investigation during the night, after arresting the suspect and investigating the body's surroundings.
Either way, this police force is incompetent enough for just about anything to fly.
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For some reason, I feel like this episode was quite good compared to the last. Despite the contradictions that exists (which we all knew) through the game's timeline, I feel like it doesn't matter too much. Also, I think the OST is growing on me! The pacing was also quite good, and felt less awkward. I have high hopes for the episodes to come.
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Redd White's voice is awesome, Maya's voice is good, Gumshoe's voice is a bit too deep and not scruffy, and Grossberg's voice is BLOODY PERFECT.
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Contrary to what most would say, I feel this episode didn't hit all the right notes, as opposed to the first episode.

I didn't mind the pacing of the first episode. It's a case that shouldn't last too long; the judge's comments on how quickly Nick uncovered the truth would be a testament to it. And yet, without dragging things out, they kept in Nick's flubbing in the beginning and kept Mia's explanations succinct, even adding in one of her most famous quotes early on. While they also did skip over the extent of Larry's grief, given how quickly he cheered up in the original game, this presentation of his character is an improvement and flows much more smoothly.

However, pacing is a big issue with this episode. I feel the overall direction constantly felt the restraints of time and the scenes jumped from one to another with barely any transition or pause to take in what's actually happening. I don't believe pacing would be as big of an issue during the trial segments, as those moments of revelation come in full force, one after another, and it's a natural progression. However, the investigations are meant to be taken at a bit more leisurely pace, if just enough to allow the players/viewers absorb the facts of the case they've gathered.

I do enjoy the liberties they've taken to change up the pace of the case, though, as well as those little detailed touches they made with Nick's expressions (during the close-ups, which have the better quality art). The level of awkward between him and Maya was also adorable. However, as much as we can insult the Japanifornian police force, their investigations, or lack thereof, this time were even more insulting than usual. What about the outdated autopsy report? Are we not touching on this? :(

Also, there were one too many shots of Edgeworth than there needed be. He only needed to show up when Nick was recalling the rumors about him and when they arrived in court. (That sick drift to park tho... and right in front of the courthouse! Disrespect, yo.)

Nonetheless, I am pleased that Grossberg finally has more than two facial expressions. Redd White's constant flashing smiles could get annoying later... but it adds to his splendiferousness, so I can't really complain.

Voice acting in this series so far has been top-notch. I don't have any complaints on VA quality. And I don't usually look forward to English dubs, but I'm curious how well (or not) it would turn out if Funimation or some other does take on the project. The inconsistency with the art, meanwhile, is something I'm so used to seeing with regular anime shows that I really don't care at this point. They could be stick figures even, but as long as the VA is this good, I'd be satisfied.
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Also, there were one too many shots of Edgeworth than there needed be. He only needed to show up when Nick was recalling the rumors about him and when they arrived in court. (That sick drift to park tho... and right in front of the courthouse! Disrespect, yo.)


There is no such thing as too much Edgeworth! :edgeworth:


Ahem, leaving my character preferences aside for the moment, which scene is it you thought should be removed? :oops:
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:edgeworth: This episode's something else to Phoenix's reasoning to helping out Maya here from his past, and his goal in being a lawyer in the first place. And wouldn't you know? That it also shows him to go up against Miles Edgeworth as well. Smoking hot for those two guys. lol
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I really liked this episode more than the first one.
Absolutely amazing to see Phoenix struggling to get an attorney to save Maya, and the two of them dialoguing at the detention center on the half end of the episode. Truly amazing.

And that flashback show Phoenix being accused, and putting Maya on his place at the time... No words for that, Phoenix really is a hero.
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Nerdowl wrote:
Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Also, there were one too many shots of Edgeworth than there needed be. He only needed to show up when Nick was recalling the rumors about him and when they arrived in court. (That sick drift to park tho... and right in front of the courthouse! Disrespect, yo.)


There is no such thing as too much Edgeworth! :edgeworth:


Ahem, leaving my character preferences aside for the moment, which scene is it you thought should be removed? :oops:

The scene with him driving on the highway. Why? I mean, I really love the part where he swerved right in front of the courthouse, but that's all we need as a nod to his amazing driving skills. Instead, they could have taken those few seconds for a montage to add a bit more to Nick's struggle of going door-to-door to find another law firm. I think it would have been better allocation of their time.

I also couldn't care for the sequence of watching Edgeworth walk into court, but I suppose to build up hype for the next episode, it had to be done.
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I'm not sure why people are saying the art's bad. When you look at the quality of the backgrounds, you can see that isn't at all true. The flat shading on the characters is a deliberate design choice the series is making.

Now, obviously if you don't like that, then that's fine. But it's more accurate to say that then to say it's bad.

As for pacing, it's the only way they're going to fit in all of the episodes. 1 ep per phase. (Which makes me wonder how they'll turn Turnabout Samurai and Turnabout goodbyes into 2day trials)
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I highly doubt they'd squeeze 1-3 and 1-4 into 2-day trials; they each went on for 3. This does suggest we're looking at another 2/3 episodes to finish 1-2 and another 4/5 episodes for 1-3, maybe with 1-4, they'll go in-depth a bit more with 6/7 episodes. But that's already one full cour, so I do not see RftA making the cut unless as a single OVA, but even that is cutting out too much.

If AA is successful enough to reach a 2nd season, they ought to continue from GS3 and add in RftA then, like following the order of game releases. By the game script alone, RftA is long enough by itself that it could fill an entire GS1, the GBA ver.
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
I highly doubt they'd squeeze 1-3 and 1-4 into 2-day trials; they each went on for 3. This does suggest we're looking at another 2/3 episodes to finish 1-2 and another 4/5 episodes for 1-3, maybe with 1-4, they'll go in-depth a bit more with 6/7 episodes. But that's already one full cour, so I do not see RftA making the cut unless as a single OVA, but even that is cutting out too much.

If AA is successful enough to reach a 2nd season, they ought to continue from GS3 and add in RftA then, like following the order of game releases. By the game script alone, RftA is long enough by itself that it could fill an entire GS1, the GBA ver.

RftA could be one or two OVAs after the main series.

Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Nerdowl wrote:
Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Also, there were one too many shots of Edgeworth than there needed be. He only needed to show up when Nick was recalling the rumors about him and when they arrived in court. (That sick drift to park tho... and right in front of the courthouse! Disrespect, yo.)


There is no such thing as too much Edgeworth! :edgeworth:

Ahem, leaving my character preferences aside for the moment, which scene is it you thought should be removed? :oops:

The scene with him driving on the highway. Why? I mean, I really love the part where he swerved right in front of the courthouse, but that's all we need as a nod to his amazing driving skills. Instead, they could have taken those few seconds for a montage to add a bit more to Nick's struggle of going door-to-door to find another law firm. I think it would have been better allocation of their time.

I also couldn't care for the sequence of watching Edgeworth walk into court, but I suppose to build up hype for the next episode, it had to be done.

Well, not necessarily. They used the Edgeworth driving his car vs Nick bicycling montage to show us how much more privileged and of higher status Edgeworth is due to being an esteemed prosecutor vs Nick being a lowly attorney. It's a really funny metaphor too IMO.
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10/10 had Maya.

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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
I highly doubt they'd squeeze 1-3 and 1-4 into 2-day trials; they each went on for 3. This does suggest we're looking at another 2/3 episodes to finish 1-2 and another 4/5 episodes for 1-3, maybe with 1-4, they'll go in-depth a bit more with 6/7 episodes. But that's already one full cour, so I do not see RftA making the cut unless as a single OVA, but even that is cutting out too much.

If AA is successful enough to reach a 2nd season, they ought to continue from GS3 and add in RftA then, like following the order of game releases. By the game script alone, RftA is long enough by itself that it could fill an entire GS1, the GBA ver.

Well, 1-3 was already longer than it needed to be in the game, so it could be done. Maybe moving Manella's testimony to the first day and Cody to the last one. The investigations had a lot of classic point-and-click adventure shenanigans going on that wouldn't really make sense in anime, so they could also be shortened.

1-4, on the other hand, has to take its sweet amount of episodes to show all the cool stuff. It's still hard to fit RftA anywhere. Saving it for the next season if there's one makes a lot of sense, since it could be easily changed to take place at a different point in the timeline, and T&T won't be enough to fill two courses.
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Nerdowl wrote:
Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Also, there were one too many shots of Edgeworth than there needed be. He only needed to show up when Nick was recalling the rumors about him and when they arrived in court. (That sick drift to park tho... and right in front of the courthouse! Disrespect, yo.)


There is no such thing as too much Edgeworth! :edgeworth:


Ahem, leaving my character preferences aside for the moment, which scene is it you thought should be removed? :oops:

The scene with him driving on the highway. Why? I mean, I really love the part where he swerved right in front of the courthouse, but that's all we need as a nod to his amazing driving skills. Instead, they could have taken those few seconds for a montage to add a bit more to Nick's struggle of going door-to-door to find another law firm. I think it would have been better allocation of their time.


That's the one I thought you meant.

linkenski wrote:
Well, not necessarily. They used the Edgeworth driving his car vs Nick bicycling montage to show us how much more privileged and of higher status Edgeworth is due to being an esteemed prosecutor vs Nick being a lowly attorney. It's a really funny metaphor too IMO.


^ And this is pretty much where I stand on that scene.
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I actually couldn't care less about Nick's biking montage, so that parallel doesn't strike with me either. What was that awkward camera angle shooting him from the front?

Granted, with how short they cut the encounter with April and Grossberg, I suppose that would have left a lot of room to fill the rest of the episode. Still, I'm not sure why they insisted on cutting them down. What really made the first investigation day in the original game (at least for me) was the struggle everywhere he turned. And the entire scene with April would have made an excellent comedy bit! Or, at least show Nick trying to cheer Maya up while in detention; the bit with the phone would have made a beautiful moment. Agh, missed opportunities left and right...

In hindsight, what I probably liked most was the way the episode sounded. Grossberg & White's voices were spot on, Tamaki actually sounded like Takemoto there, on point, and the music across the entirety was pretty appropriate. Also, that beautiful arrange of the Detention Center elegy!

Perhaps a second watch of the episode is in order, so I'm not basing my judgments on sudden first impressions...
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I'm not going to make a huge rant on my thoughts, as I did for the last episode. I'll just say that things have improved.

I had no issue with the pacing. They kept a really good sense of humor throughout - I loved the moment where Phoenix and Maya banged heads on the security glass while bowing to each other. Good at suspense-building regarding the murder, showing what Maya's going through, and Edgeworth's introduction. I found it weird that they are implying Phoenix and Edgeworth's relation to each other so early on. It may be because it's been a while since I've played through the first game fully, but I don't believe it became obvious they knew each other until the second case was mostly done or entirely over. I have faith they'll make it work, though.
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I love this scene.
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I definitely have a more positive outlook on this anime after having seen this episode, but I'm not sure it's a positive outlook in the way I'm enthusiastic about. As a fan of the games I'm actually finding quite a lot of interesting new stuff to appreciate (the parallelism of the flashback to Maya's situation, the book with all the names crossed out), and I do think hinting at Nick's past with Edgeworth this early allows for some juicy foreshadowing that the game couldn't really use since it didn't bring up the issue much if at all until 1-3/1-4. And I do happen to enjoy the little moments of chitchat between characters and the in-depth fleshing out of certain game events - they're making good on the fact it's an anime and doesn't have to have all its exposition squeezed into small text boxes, so a lot of the interactions feel more organic. This was actually one of the biggest hurdles video games tend to have in the transition to anime, so I'm glad it was able to overcome that.

Unfortunately, I don't think this does very well as an "adaptation". Mood and themes aside, Ace Attorney is still a murder-mystery series, and the playdown of the investigation sequence in this episode is not making me look forward much to the upcoming trial. If 1-1's adaptation was any indication they're also not really prioritizing what made the trials so appealing (the complete sanitation of the cross-examination was a huge letdown; Phoenix being suddenly intelligent and the lack of much suspense was a huge mood killer), so even though there's a lot for me, as a currently existing fan who's already played the games, to observe, I'm not feeling like it's going to end up standing as its own work. The characters are "nice", but if I forget the game's context I don't feel they're being very "unique", and I even feel like some of the characters got made into somewhat more boring variants - is it just me, or does Nick feel way too obliging and polite? Him cheerfully playing along to Gumshoe's verbal tic just feels really out of place, and the way my friend put it at this point Maya might call something a ladder and this Nick might agree. (I understand that the Japanese version is a little different from the localized version, but I do have a passing familiarity with the Japanese version and a certain degree of comprehension, and it still feels out of place.) Nick was interesting as a protagonist because he was basically getting everyone thrown at him while he had an implicit :| face through a lot of it, but this anime's "justice-minded nice guy" is a rather generic model. And even though initially Yuuki Aoi sounded like a good fit for Maya in vocal range, I don't know if I like the voice direction they're giving her; even the Maya on the phone seemed like a lot more naive/immature than the sort of upstart troll we know her as, so she seems a lot more like a generic moe girl. (I hope they'll change my mind later, of course; it's only episode 2 and we haven't seen much of her yet.)

I also don't know if I agree with being so revealing about Redd White being the killer right now; it was certainly obvious in the original as well, but if they continue to be so blasé about revealing their murderers it's not going to be interesting as a murder mystery anymore. Even if the anime does better in certain ways the game didn't do as well with, "slightly more appealing character narrative with lackluster murder mystery" isn't going to cut it. And unfortunately the anime is still on a kids' slot with low budget, so although the writer clearly has a lot of narrative and artistic ideas, the studio doesn't seem to have the capacity to execute it, so a lot of scenes that should be coming off as emotional look rather pathetic with faces falling halfway off. Since a lot of the reason people wanted an AA anime so badly was to see some of the more emotional scenes executed in a visual manner, that's a pretty serious blow.

So in the end I don't know what to really say. I can see myself enjoying this anime in the following episodes for the further character depth and inside look on the characters' domestic lives, and I particularly trust this anime's writer (he specializes in kids' anime, some of which are video game adaptations themselves, and has quite a knack for good character writing), but with its level of pacing and questionable execution I don't think I could recommend this at all to my friends who haven't played the games to show them why I like Ace Attorney. I'm not particularly expecting it to have everything from the game, but I feel like it ends up suffering more from being an adaptation than anything else - in fact, if it had eschewed the adaptation factor and been made up entirely of original cases in Phoenix and Maya's life, or if it had tried to invent its own distinct take on the mood and suspense like the Miike film did, it might have even been better.
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title

Igi ari!

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Aster Selene wrote:
I definitely have a more positive outlook on this anime after having seen this episode, but I'm not sure it's a positive outlook in the way I'm enthusiastic about. As a fan of the games I'm actually finding quite a lot of interesting new stuff to appreciate (the parallelism of the flashback to Maya's situation, the book with all the names crossed out), and I do think hinting at Nick's past with Edgeworth this early allows for some juicy foreshadowing that the game couldn't really use since it didn't bring up the issue much if at all until 1-3/1-4. And I do happen to enjoy the little moments of chitchat between characters and the in-depth fleshing out of certain game events - they're making good on the fact it's an anime and doesn't have to have all its exposition squeezed into small text boxes, so a lot of the interactions feel more organic. This was actually one of the biggest hurdles video games tend to have in the transition to anime, so I'm glad it was able to overcome that.

Unfortunately, I don't think this does very well as an "adaptation". Mood and themes aside, Ace Attorney is still a murder-mystery series, and the playdown of the investigation sequence in this episode is not making me look forward much to the upcoming trial. If 1-1's adaptation was any indication they're also not really prioritizing what made the trials so appealing (the complete sanitation of the cross-examination was a huge letdown; Phoenix being suddenly intelligent and the lack of much suspense was a huge mood killer), so even though there's a lot for me, as a currently existing fan who's already played the games, to observe, I'm not feeling like it's going to end up standing as its own work. The characters are "nice", but if I forget the game's context I don't feel they're being very "unique", and I even feel like some of the characters got made into somewhat more boring variants - is it just me, or does Nick feel way too obliging and polite? Him cheerfully playing along to Gumshoe's verbal tic just feels really out of place, and the way my friend put it at this point Maya might call something a ladder and this Nick might agree. (I understand that the Japanese version is a little different from the localized version, but I do have a passing familiarity with the Japanese version and a certain degree of comprehension, and it still feels out of place.) Nick was interesting as a protagonist because he was basically getting everyone thrown at him while he had an implicit :| face through a lot of it, but this anime's "justice-minded nice guy" is a rather generic model. And even though initially Yuuki Aoi sounded like a good fit for Maya in vocal range, I don't know if I like the voice direction they're giving her; even the Maya on the phone seemed like a lot more naive/immature than the sort of upstart troll we know her as, so she seems a lot more like a generic moe girl. (I hope they'll change my mind later, of course; it's only episode 2 and we haven't seen much of her yet.)

I also don't know if I agree with being so revealing about Redd White being the killer right now; it was certainly obvious in the original as well, but if they continue to be so blasé about revealing their murderers it's not going to be interesting as a murder mystery anymore. Even if the anime does better in certain ways the game didn't do as well with, "slightly more appealing character narrative with lackluster murder mystery" isn't going to cut it. And unfortunately the anime is still on a kids' slot with low budget, so although the writer clearly has a lot of narrative and artistic ideas, the studio doesn't seem to have the capacity to execute it, so a lot of scenes that should be coming off as emotional look rather pathetic with faces falling halfway off. Since a lot of the reason people wanted an AA anime so badly was to see some of the more emotional scenes executed in a visual manner, that's a pretty serious blow.

So in the end I don't know what to really say. I can see myself enjoying this anime in the following episodes for the further character depth and inside look on the characters' domestic lives, and I particularly trust this anime's writer (he specializes in kids' anime, some of which are video game adaptations themselves, and has quite a knack for good character writing), but with its level of pacing and questionable execution I don't think I could recommend this at all to my friends who haven't played the games to show them why I like Ace Attorney. I'm not particularly expecting it to have everything from the game, but I feel like it ends up suffering more from being an adaptation than anything else - in fact, if it had eschewed the adaptation factor and been made up entirely of original cases in Phoenix and Maya's life, or if it had tried to invent its own distinct take on the mood and suspense like the Miike film did, it might have even been better.


I would like to object to some things:
1) The "sanitation" of cross-examination is, I think, just fine. If the staff counter-checks how cross-examinations are in real life, I think the rapid fire answering of contradictions rather than showing evidence after judge announces that your cross-examination starts is more natural. Also, it would be better to portray Phoenix as intelligent. He is a lawyer after all, he is expected to be intelligent. With that said, I disagree with how the adaptation's portrayal of Mia. Why would she tell that "contradictions are everything bla bla", she is not talking to a video game player but to a lawyer who passed a bar exam . In addition, many anime-only people are complaining already that the first case is easy that it really did not needed suspense (since they already considered it to have suspense with all that music and over-the-top reactions). The trials will improve over time, since this first case is not just that great for leaving a good impression for adaptations, no matter how you want it to look good in anime.
2) I think in the game he actually imitates Gumshoe's verbal tic too; However, Gumshoe would scold Nick after imitating his "endearing character trait".
3)
Spoiler:
Redd White is revealed. Yes. But, is he really shown as the killer at this point? If I have no knowledge in the games, I would think that Redd White is just someone who is illegally listening to someone else's conversation and ordering some lawyer not to take a certain case. Plus when he is indeed revealed as the killer before the trial, depending on the execution of direction, it could arise a feelings of excitement ("I want to catch that man!") and wonder ("How do you even imprison a man who is virtually untouchable by law?") I think this would make people realize how unfair the justice system is in Phoenix Wright's universe and ultimately separate the show from the generic "whodunit" shows.

4) I played this case again just a week ago, and it does not really give off the "murder mystery" vibe suited for a medium like anime. I could be wrong here, since I also watched the movie about 6 years ago, but cannot quite remember how the director executed it.
5) Expounding on the drama and character development is I think fine for this adaptation. Also, making the anime seem shounen is fine for me as well so that its unique themes can reach a wider audience. Showing a different take on themes like friendship (that eventually leads to pursuit of truth, which is what makes Nick's and Miles's bond special) and believing in one's self (and in your client's innocence when no one else can trust them) and then showing more mature themes like fighting against injustice brought about by the flawed legal system and giving up perfection in pursuit of truth will add charm to the show. I don't think a lot of anime today are like that- or should I say, no other anime is like that. If you have seen Bakuman, a meta-anime about making manga, it is so lighthearted but it also shows harsh realities of the life a manga author and it also shows different takes on common shounen themes. I believe (or rather, want to believe) that this is the direction the anime is going to show.

In general, I think the anime is going in a great direction. The games are more than the murder mysteries and courtroom battles. If you just compare the stories of other anime to the story of the games, it really gives that feeling that the anime adaptation will become an anime classic- along with the likes of FMA:B, Steins;Gate, Gintama and Bakuman. It is not your everyday cliche anime with bland character who stumbles upon 1000 high school girls in awkward positions, only to proceed with a story with no depth or proper closure whatsoever. Ha, I made a rather bold claim but I really just want this to get off my chest.
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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Aster Selene wrote:
The characters are "nice", but if I forget the game's context I don't feel they're being very "unique", and I even feel like some of the characters got made into somewhat more boring variants - is it just me, or does Nick feel way too obliging and polite? Him cheerfully playing along to Gumshoe's verbal tic just feels really out of place, and the way my friend put it at this point Maya might call something a ladder and this Nick might agree. (I understand that the Japanese version is a little different from the localized version, but I do have a passing familiarity with the Japanese version and a certain degree of comprehension, and it still feels out of place.) Nick was interesting as a protagonist because he was basically getting everyone thrown at him while he had an implicit :| face through a lot of it, but this anime's "justice-minded nice guy" is a rather generic model.

I think so too that it's a little out of place, though it doesn't bother me that much ever since I read through the interviews with Watanabe and Takumi. I think just about everyone on the staff have come to agree with or at least acknowledge that Phoenix was shaped after Takumi, so it may have been a conscious decision on their part that they drew out a bit more of Takumi's personality in him as well. I don't know if this parallel to the creator himself is appropriate in any context, honestly, but it does make a nice allegory with the metaphor of spring.

Quote:
I also don't know if I agree with being so revealing about Redd White being the killer right now; it was certainly obvious in the original as well, but if they continue to be so blasé about revealing their murderers it's not going to be interesting as a murder mystery anymore. Even if the anime does better in certain ways the game didn't do as well with, "slightly more appealing character narrative with lackluster murder mystery" isn't going to cut it.

To be fair, this is only the second case and following the game's original direction. They're certainly not going to keep up with the obvious murderers throughout... except for maybe Wellington, but eh, tutorial cases.

AAI2bestAA wrote:
I think in the game he actually imitates Gumshoe's verbal tic too; However, Gumshoe would scold Nick after imitating his "endearing character trait".

No, he didn't, in any version of the game. That didn't come until 1-3, and it was Maya who did.

Quote:
I played this case again just a week ago, and it does not really give off the "murder mystery" vibe suited for a medium like anime. I could be wrong here, since I also watched the movie about 6 years ago, but cannot quite remember how the director executed it.

Miike is known for his more serious themes in film, and I think his adaptation of Ace Attorney hit all the right notes in giving that proper murder mystery vibe; with the dim lighting on certain scenes, the suspenseful music throughout, and the grim atmosphere even by the end of the Turnabout Sisters case. That said, Maya was a bit too mellow for my tastes throughout the movie, even if she did still have her silly moments. In fact, it wasn't just Maya; the whole movie was a little too dark and edgy for what Ace Attorney usually represents.

Watanabe, meanwhile, does kids' shows, so it's only expected he'd offer a lighter and cuter or more exaggerated take on everything. Though the original case is meant to give off a serious tone throughout, Ace Attorney has always been about overturning the drama and suspense with even more drama and suspense, but with a distinctly different flavor each time. It may be more suited to anime in that sense.

I am just not very fond of the oversaturation of cherry blossoms. Is this a mystery or a romantic comedy? It is heavily leaning toward the latter so far.

Quote:
Also, making the anime seem shounen is fine for me as well so that its unique themes can reach a wider audience. Showing a different take on themes like friendship (that eventually leads to pursuit of truth, which is what makes Nick's and Miles's bond special) and believing in one's self (and in your client's innocence when no one else can trust them) and then showing more mature themes like fighting against injustice brought about by the flawed legal system and giving up perfection in pursuit of truth will add charm to the show. I don't think a lot of anime today are like that- or should I say, no other anime is like that.

What you described here is very prevalent among shonen and seinen (young adult) anime. In fact, it's more prevalent when it comes to parodies of classic genres. In the manga (haven't seen much of the anime) One-Punch Man for example, there is a curious mix of the kid-friendly with the mature. As much as this anime loves recycling the classic superhero tropes, to the point of audacious hyperbole, it's still quite down-to-earth with its harsh realism regarding the status of superheroes. (Actually, this was one of the things I enjoyed most about The Incredibles.)

That Ace Attorney asks deep questions of the status quo of the country's judicial system while taking silliness to extremes is not exactly original. (It may have been back when the game was first released on the GBA. 2001 was a very different time.) How it does stand out, however, is through its memetic potential. And I believe that's where the anime is headed; cranking up the ham to eleven and getting some pot roast out of it.
Help! My parents are Phoenix Wright & Miles Edgeworth! Er, I mean they're irresponsible drunks!

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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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Actually PWAA's subtle clues to the classroom trial and Maya's mother and the DL6 incident is something I think is perfect and one of the reasons I like T&T less than PWAA. When I got to 1-4 every time there was some kind of throwback to the classroom trial it hooked me right away because it had been shown so few times and so sparse throughout 1-2 that I could just remember it enough for it to have a certain resonance. For example during the final meeting with Maya in the detention center before the first trial in the game Phoenix thinks "Actually, I fully understand her situation. I've been there before" and a very quick flash in less than a couple of seconds of the classroom trial appear and you're just like "huh." which is good because then when you finally reach 1-4 and it actually becomes more integral to the plot at hand (Edgeworth) it has a much stronger resonance and you do remember "there was something about this, wasn't there?".

In that sense I'm slightly less hot about how this anime foreshadows everything several times again and again in each episode so far. You don't want foreshadowing and flashbacks to end up being like "yeah... I get it now". Don't think it's going that far, but it's going to the point where everyone will get it right away or be able to predict a lot of what's going to eventually happen, and I liked when you had to really think along with the plot instead of the plot spoonfeeding you all the info twice.

Also, now that Rubia mentioned it, I do wanna agree that there was a lack of nuance in that it didn't really show us Nick struggling enough. It was a bit too easy going and in hindsight that's probably where it kinda sucked that Grossberg took the case temporarily and Phoenix just decided to snoop even though it wasn't by necessity. It seems a bit like Watanabe felt he wanted to change something without realizing the literary meat of the plot-pieces he flipped around or cut out.

Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
I am just not very fond of the oversaturation of cherry blossoms. Is this a mystery or a romantic comedy? It is heavily leaning toward the latter so far.

Everyone has their Phoenix and Maya fangirl in them, even Watanabe :hotti:
This is the Dark Age of the Ace Attorney
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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At this rate, by the end of this series, Gumshoe and Pearl will compete in throwing around cherry blossoms instead of confetti. And Charley will bloom, even if he's not a flowering plant... granted that they keep Farewell, My Turnabout in March.
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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title

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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
At this rate, by the end of this series, Gumshoe and Pearl will compete in throwing around cherry blossoms instead of confetti.

You say this as though it's a problem. :P
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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Enoshima Junko-chan!

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Next episode is the debut of the infamous updated autopsy report. I look forward to seeing how it's handled, and Phoenix's response ("I'm a sham!")
11037
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title

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I actually enjoyed this episode(To my surprise, because I thought these episodes would be the most boring episodes :phoenix: )
Anyways, like other people said, Grossberg's or Groddyburger :grossberg: (If you watch Ace Idiot, you'd understand :yogi: ) and Redd White's :redd: voices match PERFECTLY! I also enjoyed Maya's voice , as well. What I didn't enjoy, though, are the dates, and Edgeworth's appearances. April 4th -April 6th datew doesn't even closely match the September dates(to be honest, this doesn't bother me too much, but it still does annoy me :dahlia: ) and Edgeworth's appearances, they should have shown him the way the games did, through the talk about Edgey and the whole rumers about him.

Anyways, that's all I have to say :gant: :gregory: :yogi: :redd:
The Final Verdict you may ask? 9/10
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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RedPotato wrote:
April 4th -April 6th datew doesn't even closely match the September dates(to be honest, this doesn't bother me too much, but it still does annoy me :dahlia: )


This is based on the Japanese version of the game. Pretty sure they use the settings used in the Japanese version, too. (Cindy Stone going to New York, etc.)
~UltrawaveStudios~
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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title

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MBr wrote:
Next episode is the debut of the infamous updated autopsy report. I look forward to seeing how it's handled, and Phoenix's response ("I'm a sham!")

Me too! :jake:
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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UltrawaveStudios wrote:
RedPotato wrote:
April 4th -April 6th datew doesn't even closely match the September dates(to be honest, this doesn't bother me too much, but it still does annoy me :dahlia: )


This is based on the Japanese version of the game. Pretty sure they use the settings used in the Japanese version, too. (Cindy Stone going to New York, etc.)

No, the dates were changed intentionally to parallel the start of Nick's legal career with the sakura blooming season. All these cherry blossoms are going to stay stuck on him and his suit, and by the end of the series, he will dress in pink.
Help! My parents are Phoenix Wright & Miles Edgeworth! Er, I mean they're irresponsible drunks!

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Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
UltrawaveStudios wrote:
RedPotato wrote:
April 4th -April 6th datew doesn't even closely match the September dates(to be honest, this doesn't bother me too much, but it still does annoy me :dahlia: )


This is based on the Japanese version of the game. Pretty sure they use the settings used in the Japanese version, too. (Cindy Stone going to New York, etc.)

No, the dates were changed intentionally to parallel the start of Nick's legal career with the sakura blooming season. All these cherry blossoms are going to stay stuck on him and his suit, and by the end of the series, he will dress in pink.

:edgeworth: : Wright! Did you take one of my suits without asking?
:phoenix: : H-Huh? Ah, no. *brushes off the sakura petals*
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So Edgeworth's suits are threaded from sakura petals? Wow, talk about taking "ostentatious and arrogant" to another level. It's like there's a potential explanation for why Edgeworth has a blue overcoat, shown in JFA. Is it because he'd blend in so well with the cherry blossoms that he has to wear a contrasting color to be seen?
Help! My parents are Phoenix Wright & Miles Edgeworth! Er, I mean they're irresponsible drunks!

Click here for the Gyakuten Saiban vs Ace Attorney Translation Project Blog!
Various official AA stuff translations currently in the works.

Also, click here for the current archive of fanfiction or here for the backup archive. Click here for the blog that updates it.
Includes translations of misc. fan works related or not to AA.
Also, a very popular fanfic ask meme.
Re: Episode 2: "Turnabout Sisters - 1st Trial"Topic%20Title

Jolly, Wrighto! Care to go swimming?

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:udgey:

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