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Re: Characters/Cases analysisTopic%20Title
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Wax Philosophical Power Hour

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Major spoilers for GS6

Nahyuta’s character arc and relation to Apollo seen through Perl’s layer theory, part 1
(This got waaaay longer than expected, and it's about Nahyuta, but I'm writing this for my own amusement anyway, so if anyone besides myself actually reads it I'll consider it a bonus xD)

One of the first things Ema says about Nahyuta in case 2, before we have met him ourselves, is that he’s “hard to read” and “doesn’t really share his thoughts”. He is indeed a bit of a tough nut to crack(-a-lack) and reach through, though I think there is a lot to find, if one is willing to look for it. I definitely was when replaying SoJ, especially during case five from “Do you disagree?” and forward I found myself focusing a lot on him, and I personally think Nahyuta delivers as a character who may not have the kind of capturing presence as prosecutors before him such as Edgeworth or Simon, but is fascinating and intriguing in his own way.

I think Turnabout Revolution is without a doubt the case where he’s at his best, for various reasons, but I always liked him, because he’s a total bitch for one. It defied my expectations – judging from his fairytale prince-like appearance and the floating shawl and gorgeous smile, his profession as a monk and him being called “the last rites prosecutor”, I was expecting some well-mannered, calm, holier-than-thou-kind of character, then he comes along and is rude as shit, gives people stupid nicknames, makes threats about getting tickled for five million years in the afterlife and getting reborn as a reverse panda or a stinkbug, and gets attacked by his own beads resulting in him falling on his arse in every case he appears in.

That’s not to say he doesn’t get “way over the top as far as verbal abuse goes”, as Athena put it in case two, and speaking of Athena, his treatment of her in case four was definitely his lowest point – not only was he rude, but downright cruel at times. Still, there’s something about the very concept of a bitchy monk that I can’t not love although it certainly wouldn’t have been enough to keep my interest in him up to the end (or to case five).

I recently stumbled upon Fritz Perl’s five-level structure of neurosis and thought that it reminded me of a certain someone, so I thought I’d try to view Nahyuta’s arc with that theory, including his relationship with Apollo – because we mainly get to know him through Apollo’s eyes, plus his arc is mainly set in motion with the help of Apollo. It is also nice to see how it changes throughout the game.

But first of all, what was he like before this “neurosis”, or crisis? From flashbacks and how other characters – Apollo and Dhurke – talk about him (and in Apollo’s case, think about him), the child Nahyuta is described as “kind and cheerful” and “very smart”, but Apollo also complains to himself that Nahyuta has always been really stubborn about his beliefs. He also took Dhurke’s teachings to heart and had a strong sense of justice and determination. At first glance, he seems to have made a complete 180 from his child-personality, but later, it becomes apparent that a lot of this has seemingly remained in his very core, and re-surfaces throughout the game.

Spoiler: The cliché layer
On to the present, and the first layer: the cliché layer (descriptions and citations are taken from the book Fritz Perls by Clarkson and Mackewn). The cliché layer includes “meaningless tokens of meetings” and “clichéd greetings” with no relation to the actual feelings of the involved individuals, and basically consists of “introjects of expected, socially accepted behavior”. The first time we ever see Nahyuta in the courtroom he’s deep in prayer, and when the judge calls for his attention, his first lines are “…A thousand pardons. It was rude of me to keep you waiting. I was praying for the victim.” He’s praying for the victim as is custom in Khura’in, but he’s also consciously trying to follow the customs of the Japanifornian court, and goes on to express himself in a humble way and apologize in advance for the “many blunders” he may make. Back in Japanifornia in case four, Nahyuta says he’s fully prepared right away, which surprises the judge, to which Nahyuta explains he has already finished the praying in the lobby before the trial to expedite it, which the judge considers thoughtful of him. By this, we can tell he’s starting to adapt to the Japanifornian way of proceeding (apart from the nasty words and bead-throwing, that is).

For reference, we can compare this to the start of the trial in case 3, which takes place in Khura’in: once again he starts by silently praying, while the Khura’inese judge patiently waits for him to finish (and shuts down Phoenix for disturbing him), and laughs and says “Splendid!” when Nahyuta promises to cast Phoenix’ and Maya’s “wicked souls” into the pits of hell. Jolly.

As for him and Apollo, the first thing Nahyuta ever says to Apollo in the game is “…If the defense wouldn’t mind… …could you please explain your reasoning?”. He’s coming across as polite, but extremely impersonal towards his brother he hasn’t seen for fifteen years – “meaningless tokens”, “clichéd” and without relation to feelings towards the individual indeed. After the trial, when Apollo tries to talk to him, Nahyuta attempts to maintain this by claiming that the two of them, now that the trial is over are “once again strangers, with no further need to interact” (which causes Apollo to question if Nahyuta has actually forgotten all about him and it’s absolutely crushing, so screw you, Nahyuta), but Apollo won’t have it.


Spoiler: The role layer
The second layer is the role layer, in which the person acts “as if [they] were whatever [their] role is” and might pretend to be better, or tougher, more polite or more pathetic than they really feel. If my understanding on these “layers” is correct, I’d say that this is where Nahyuta spends most parts of the game, up until case five. He is fulfilling his role as a devout monk, and as the “last rites prosecutor”, and the second Apollo explains that he believes in his client, the insults and sutras comes out, because “it is my duty as a monk to punish sinners, and to guide victim’s souls to the Twilight Realm” and “should you interfere with my sacred last rites for the victim… then I shall cast you down into the pit of hell, along with Trucy Wright!”. Apollo questions whether this is “any way to address someone in a court of law” and the judge agrees, but Nahyuta tells them it’s “but a Khura’inist sermon for those who have strayed from the path”. The asking for forgiveness and patience for blunders he might make is a thing of two minutes ago, and the bitch is out to play. I don’t think any more examples of his… let’s call it “fierceness” are needed to get the point across. By the epilogue, he even admits himself that he’s “merciless in the Halls of Justice”. And by the end of case 2, when Apollo keeps on trying to talk to him, he switches from “we’re once again strangers” to claiming he has nothing to say to the likes of him.

He keeps this up during a portion of case five, but as he starts breaking down, it seems more like an attempt to act in a role that used to come naturally to him. Compare his first lines or lack thereof in the trials of cases 2, 3 and 4 with that in case 5, in which he stutters and zones out to the point where Apollo and the judge both appear concerned, and Ga’ran decides he’s unfit to prosecute.

Another role cast upon him is that of a protector and guardian, both for the kingdom itself and his sister. Especially after Dhurke’s death, he claims it to be his duty as the oldest Sahdmadhi to protect Rayfa, and asks Apollo to try to understand that.

However, even though his various roles are ingrained in him (which was partly my point in the other post I made about Nahyuta) it obviously doesn’t mean that they are all there is to him. Although he’s clearly under Ga’ran’s influence, having internalized her ideas and opinions, one could even say he’s basically brainwashed, he’s not just that, which becomes apparent in what I'd call personality leakages.


Spoiler: Personality leakage
Beyond the rigid bitch we get to see glimpses of something else, which possibly would have been more present in his personality under other circumstances. From his dialogue and behaviour, we can see hints of him having a slightly harsh sense of humour, and being a very curious person who likes to learn – doing research on the topics he’ll meet in his trials is one thing (especially if one can brag about it), sitting for hours on end researching rakugo to the point where he has stories memorized, culminating in him performing “Time soba” in court (which gets even better as he’s just said that rakugo storytellers use distinctive voices for the different characters, so one can assume he does too in his reciting) is another. He apparently gets easily immersed in various subjects he finds interesting, and this scene amongst others is also a nice contrast to his refined speech and usual pokerface, showing that despite that, he’s absolutely not as stiff and overly serious as he might come across. What’s crack-a-lacking, homie?

These glimpses of excitement appear in other ways as well, such as standing in line for two hours for a burger, or lovingly describing why peach is his favourite fruit. He also seems genuinely interested in forensic science (to the point of dragging Ema back and forth between Khura’in and Japanifornia), and speaking of Ema, before the trial of case 2, before we’ve met Nahyuta, she describes him as kind, gentle and understanding, which seems to clash majorly with the major bitch he turns out to be. Still, it makes sense that his ruthless behaviour would be more of a courtroom thing, especially when he’s being challenged. Other than that, we mostly get to see him in pretty loaded situations, but it’s possible that how Ema described him is how he behaves in more relaxed situations (which would have been nice to see more of), and also ties in nicely with the personality Apollo remembers him to have had as a child.

You can’t always tell whether he’s serious or not (giving the silly descriptions of various kinds of hell, or saying “what’s crack-a-lacking, homie” with a completely straight face is one thing, but no one can convince me that him threatening to punish Ema by holding an eight-hour sermon wasn’t solely to take the piss). His quarrelling with Simon in case four is worth a mention just because it was so gloriously stupid (and finally somebody managed to really talk back to Nahyuta). “Be gone, witness! No more shall you haunt this sacred hall!” Face-crack of the century.

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Ah, neat-o, I like the idea to use Perl's (wrote "Pearl's" at first) layer (now I wrote "lawyer") theory. :D You're dedicated! Nahyuta would be proud.
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Thankya. Yeah, it felt like it gave it more substance. :) I'm curious about Pearl's lawyer theory. Haha, great. I get easily immersed in prosecutors I find interesting :edgey:
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Major spoilers for GS6
Nahyuta’s character arc and relation to Apollo seen through Perl’s layer theory, part 2

Spoiler: The impasse layer
The impasse layer involves dropped roles, feelings of stuckness, confusion and anxiety, “two aspects of ourselves” being “locked in a conflict”. It is described as a very uncomfortable phase, where the person might either attempt to “complete unfinished business” or try to “avoid suffering” by denying “existential dread or anxiety”. Come case five and this fits Nahyuta to a t. Dhurke tells Apollo in the cave scene already that Nahyuta is “suffering in silence” and that something is “tearing him apart”, but so far, he has been able to push through that, repressing the shred of doubt, and hope, that he still has, and resign to his role for the sake of his convictions, seemingly more or less going numb in the process. Once Dhurke is arrested, however, he finds himself in a situation where he is forced to prosecute his father (and indirectly his brother) in order to protect his mother and sister. Whatever he does, something’s got to give, and unable to admit to himself that it’s a really shitty situation with no good outcome, he tries to lean back on his convictions, only to find that the situation is smacking him in the face to the point where even they have gone shaking.

The first time we see Nahyuta in case five is when he’s about to interrogate “the prisoner”, and at this point, he still seems to be in the “role layer”. “The fact remains, I am a prosecutor.” Apollo decides further discussion is futile, because he doubts he’s getting through to Nahyuta at all. As Dhurke talks to him, he’s quick to tell him that “the Nahyuta you knew exists no more”, but he comes across a bit hesitant, and when Dhurke tells him he’ll always be his boy, and that the Defiant Dragons will welcome him back with open arms as soon as he’s ready, he looks like he’s in physical pain, and groans, before collecting himself. “…….Ngh! ……..As I said, I’ve moved on.” He’s business as usual when speaking in broader terms, distancing himself mentally from the issue, but as soon as the conversation turns more specific and personal, he has trouble saying anything at all.

Later on, he appears in Amara’s tomb, where he bitches a little about lawyers, but when Apollo tries to talk with him about Dhurke and the Defiant Dragons, he runs away. Runs, as in, Apollo and Athena have to chase him down. When they do, he tries to leave again, which makes Apollo ask if Nahyuta is afraid of what Apollo has to say, which probably hits the nail on the head. The attempt to reach out fails miserably as the conversation turns into a debate in which the participants have two completely different goals – while Apollo tries to connect with Nahyuta, and get him to be honest about not wanting to prosecute Dhurke, or at the very least wishing he didn’t have to, Nahyuta takes the subject to a higher level and talks about civilization and its need of (impersonal) law, “Do you disagree?”, so that Apollo will have to say that he doesn’t, i.e having to admit that Nahyuta prosecuting his father is completely rational and therefore justified. Athena declares Nahyuta to be the winner of the debate, but Apollo has the feeling that his “pretty words” are covering up for something, and it’s worth noting that Nahyuta never says he has no personal feelings regarding the matter, just that they have no place in a court of law, and that is all there is to that.

“(…Nahyuta. Is this the real you? Have you really changed? Can you even hear me? Don’t Dhurke and I matter to you anymore?)”
That’s the million-dollar question, ain’t it? Can Nahyuta hear those who care about him at all? At the very least, at this point, it seems like he’s starting to, although very reluctantly. Like in the in my opinion best offscreen-moment of the game, when Nahyuta confiscates Dhurke’s belongings, except for his badge. “Just when it looked like he was about to take it… he changed his mind.” And outside the temple, once the people have started protesting, he has nothing to say about it other than he’s following orders… and then he tries to flee from Apollo again. Hearing about Dhurke’s condition seems to do the trick, but: “…………………. ……………………… ………………………. …what you speak of… is futile (…) The guilty verdict… the hopelessness… You must resign yourself to it all. Clinging to false hope now will only serve to magnify your future despair. So let it go… and move on.” Deny dread and anxiety to avoid suffering? Check.
The impasse layer is described as the person experiencing it “goes into a whirlpool”, and in a similar manner, Athena claims to sense “a whirlpool of emotions” from Nahyuta at this point. Anger, shock, bewilderment. “…and an icy sorrow, as deep and dark as an abyss.” In other words, this bitch is starting to implode.


Going into the trial, Nahyuta is clearly (still) not his usual self. He’s quiet, zoned out, stutters when asked a question – even the judge feels that he has to raise his concern. The gallery starts gossiping until Dhurke shuts them down because his son is perfectly capable of prosecuting his own father without personal feelings getting in the way, thank you very much. To which Nahyuta answers that “I will not stop until my work here is done”. While supporting his son even for his own prosecution feels like a very Dhurke thing to do, Nahyuta’s reply is pretty ambiguous. Since Dhurke seems to have grasped the basics of Nahyuta’s situation, it’s possible to imagine that the conversation, at least from Nahyuta’s part, was more about protecting the rest of the family, and Dhurke encouraging him to do so. Which is pretty grand from a guy that is already dead, but still. Or something else was this “work” he was referring to… in any case, we never get to know more about that, because right then, Ga’ran steps in and declares Nahyuta unfit to prosecute. Hearing this, Nahyuta protests and acts very upset for someone who clearly didn’t want to prosecute in the first place. Surely, nothing good will come from the queen herself stepping in in his place, but even so, I can’t help but get the feeling that Nahyuta had something in mind that Ga’ran effectively stopped him from doing… like losing the trial on purpose (he’s a smart guy, he could probably find a way to do it without it being too obvious).

Spoiler: The implosive layer
Whatever the case, the evil queen takes his place with Nahyuta as her aid and he’s pretty chill for the most part. The implosive layer is also called the “death layer” and involves “paralysis of opposing forces”; the person experiencing it pull themselves together, contract their muscles, implode. It’s an inward-turned energy, the person is tense and "paralysed by the fear of the unknown".

Nahyuta’s mostly hanging around while the courtroom drama intensifies, save for some Klavier-style prosecuting on the side: that is, going with the flow, laying down facts and yelling at Apollo when he’s going off rails. Speaking of Apollo, when he’s proposing a really wild theory, Nahyuta seems more amused than anything: (smiling) “Oh, you putrid pepper. Of all the half-witted buffoonery to come from your lips. But suppose I indulge you.” Too bad he’s not gonna be smiling for long. Apollo lays it down, that Dhurke is dead, and Nahyuta is obviously gobsmacked and tries to deny it. “A-and you would not dare to claim to have proof to support your assertion.”


Other than gritting his teeth, we don’t see much of Nahyuta’s reaction when the theory of Dhurke’s death is ultimately proven true, since the focus is on Apollo, but it’s a breaking point. Especially after Apollo manages to pull himself together and carry on, and seeing Apollo’s newfound determination Nahyuta says, clutching his beads: “…A…pol…lo……?”. This is important. It’s very important, because up until this very point, Nahyuta has only called Apollo, his brother, “Mr. Justice”, and that’s when he’s being nice. But while Apollo finds hope in the situation, Nahyuta finds the opposite.

“Hmph. So ultimately, it was all for naught. (…) Those dreams of revolution Dhurke was always spouting… They placed nothing but false hope in the minds of the people. And in the end, they were simply fantasies. (…) Satorha! Karma has spoken. The dream of revolution has withered on its vine. Its fate is sealed. The other insurgents will soon wake from their shattered dreams.” In some way, he almost comes across as relieved: the flames of revolution have died down, or so he thinks, nothing more can happen. And then, to add salt to the wounds, his own mother claims that she was the one who killed Inga.

Spoiler: The explosive/authentic layer
The explosive layer makes the person “come to life”, they “explode into grief, anger, joy, laughter, or orgasm”. They are authentic and capable of experiencing, and expressing, real emotion. They act, they live, and the explosion is often followed by insights, creativity and excitement.
“Th-that’s preposterous!” (falls on his ass) “Wh-Whyyyyyyyyyyyyy?!” (…) “M-mother! Why would you…?!” (…) “…Mother! What is the meaning of this?!”
Next thing we know, Amara gets shot, the court takes a recess, and when we get back to the courtroom, Nahyuta has been taken away to take the witness stand, just as he was starting to explode in… something, and it wasn’t laughter or orgasm. Can a bitch ever get some rest? Not on Ga’ran’s watch. Nahyuta is backed into a corner again and Apollo and Phoenix shows about the same reaction as the player might: “not this shit again”. Apollo is once again “Mr. Justice” to Nahyuta, but Apollo himself is on fire. Figuratively. This makes it hard to pinpoint one precise explosion-point for Nahyuta, since he is forced to restrain himself once more.

Even so, this seems to be a recurring theme with him, according to Apollo. “Why do you always have to be so stubborn, Nahyuta?! I hate how you never listen to reason once you get like this!”
But he’s not completely detached.
“…….Mr. Justice. Know that Dhurke sent you away so that you would not get caught up in that life we led. “
“I see… Thanks…” The topic of Apollo’s departure hasn’t been brought up outside of Apollo’s head, just the point in time where it happened, but Nahyuta understands it’s on Apollo’s mind and goes out of his way to assure him this, for Apollo’s sake, probably, but perhaps also for Dhurke’s.

Nahyuta explains his personal feelings are “of no consequence” since his life is devoted to law, queen and country first and foremost. “I know I must accept status quo without any thoughts of change.” But Apollo won’t have it, since he’s sure that deep down, there is still hope in his heart.

“…and it’s what binds you, me, and Dhurke together… as a family.”
“……………………………………………………..Hmph. You are… very perceptive, Mr. Justice. It may very well be as you say.”
Nahyuta claims he didn’t understand it at the time, but he may have been waiting for Dhurke to save Nahyuta, and to “free our family from the chains of the past”.

“However! …It was but a dream. And now that dream has died. Murdered, along with Dhurke! So now, as the eldest, the responsibility falls squarely onto me. …No matter the cost, I must protect her! Please, try to understand, Apollo. Understand why I shall bear all this sin. It is the only way!” As far as I’m concerned, these lines are the completely authentic Nahyuta, speaking completely freely from his mind. At least, that was the feeling I got when reading them. Nahyuta 100 % unlocked. And when he’s begging Apollo to try and understand why he feels that he has to do what he does, it’s completely earnest, brother to brother.
After this, he finally starts catching on that Ga’ran is evil. “Your Eminence! It’s you, isn’t it…!” He’s the one who names her as the killer and provides a motive. “…are you the one responsible for tearing my family apart? (…) Y-you concealed the truth, and used me for your own designs?!” From here and onwards, he has a very direct way of speaking. The occasional flowy language is still there, but it’s fierce and prickly rather than high and mighty. Also, it’s worth mentioning that when Ga’ran questions him being done heeding her commands, he interrupts her, the freaking queen, with a “Satorha!”, and that’s probably my single favourite moment with him. He’s a bad, bad bitch, but in a good way now.
“Hear me, Ga’ran: I will cast you down from your bloody throne! Long live the revolution!”

Now that he’s on the same page as everyone else, he starts helping the defense, and Phoenix, Apollo and him becomes completely awesome together.
Ga’ran: “I doubt you could find them now.”
Nahyuta: “Objection! …Then you don’t know us very well.”
What he has been on about all this time, about putting the good for the kingdom before his own life, is still true, but now he considers the revolution to be the best for Khura’in, rather than heeding Ga’ran’s commands.
“…..We cannot yield to her here, Apollo. If… If it will move the revolution forward… …I will gladly face the DC act! Now, do it! Accuse Queen Ga’ran of the crime she has committed!”

Having made a complete turnabout attitude-wise, he’s still as ruthless as ever, if not more. But he also wants to keep his “dear brother”, as Ga’ran puts it, safe:
“P-please, Apollo… Do not make this any worse than it already is… I cannot lose you to the Twilight Realm, too…” Weighing up for all the “putrid pepper” and so on, he’s now using Apollo’s first name quite often, which is sweet. And he’s able to express himself fully, suffering but not in silence, straight out begging Apollo not to get himself killed, because he wouldn’t be able to bear it.
Even so, once Apollo refuses to yield, Nahyuta is seemingly impressed and claims that both a fierce dragon and a virtuous phoenix dwells deep within Apollo, and that he shall join him in his “death-defying bluff!”.
The slumbering dragon dwelling deep within him has apparently woken up, and with bravado. “Comes to life”? “Acts, lives”? “Excitement”? Check, check, check as heck.

After the trial, and when he’s done being Mr. Exposition, he’s pretty chill again. There is something almost sly about him at times, but in a rather sweet and humorous way. Like when talking about the state of Ga’ran: “*sigh* I fear it will be quite a challenge to question her later” Or when Rayfa goes “Big B… B…” and he’s all poker-faced: “…….”Buh”?” I’ll never understand whether he’s clueless or just a little bitch (said in a loving way). Or, for that matter, in the epilogue where he expresses bewilderment about being referred to “Braid head” by Rayfa, and that she’s trembling and blushing when she’s trying to speak with him, wondering what he has “done to deserve such animosity”. But he ultimately decides that maybe he shall “consult Apollo about this”, so it’ll be fine.


One last thing I find sweet about him is, when he wants something from people he appreciates, he approaches them in a very direct way that comes across as almost childlike. It’s especially noticeable after the last trial of case 5, where he simply takes Apollo to Dhurke’s old office and says: “I want you… to stay in Khura’in”, without any forewarning. “I cannot do this without you”. Not surprisingly, Apollo is taken aback by the sudden request, which Nahyuta later acknowledges and just asks him to “please give it some thought”, and although it was a bit too abrupt and put Apollo on the spot, it was endearing in how very earnest it seemed.

All in all, the set-free Nahyuta is very direct, and can be a bit forceful. We can see this in the very last scene as well, where Apollo complains about all the cases he’s got on his table, with Nahyuta telling him off because they have a lot to do, and is he gonna help him reforming the court system or not?
But he also has humour, and a just heart, even though he needs a bit of encouragement (or a lot) to get to action, but when he does, he’s absolutely ruthless, to the point of being extremely stubborn and even reckless when it concerns something, or someone, he cares deeply about. And cares deeply he does, in his own Nahyuta-way, and when set free once and for all, his language and entire behaviour subtly changes, and he does have something alluring about him, an unfeigned kind of charisma, both firm and charming.
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Oh Yuty! :acro: <3

This was a really nice and emotional read! :edgey:
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Hee hee. Thanks! And thanks for reading it! :edgey: It was pretty exhausting, but now that I've put everything I've been thinking about into words, I think I can finally let this game go, and move on... for the time being, at least. xD
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:edgey: Haha, highly understandable, labour of love and such. :D

...and I want to revisit the game, haha. I must admit that this helped even more since I thought, earlier today, that I wanted to revisit case 5 because of the atmosphere and all, and here I read a long essay about Yuty. :-P
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Do it. And then write your own super-long Nahyuta-essay, and we'll clog this thread with Nahyuta.
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Mwahaha. >:D
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Going for Miles wrote:
Do it. And then write your own super-long Nahyuta-essay, and we'll clog this thread with Nahyuta.

Not if I can help it! >:D

I think this is the right thread for this, so correct me if I'm wrong.

I really like Casting Magic as a name over Spellbreaker. Sure, at first it may sound pretty straightforward, but it's actually pretty subtle. Spellbreaker obviously refers to the 'spell' of Labyrinthia being broken, but I actually think it's too direct. Casting Magic is much more subtle. The Magic being referred to in the song's title is not a spell from a witch's staff. It's Logic! I think it actually works well because that's basically what happens when the pursuit theme plays. You're casting magic on the people of Labyrinthia- the magic of logic.

Hence, I think Casting Magic works better as a name for the PLvsAA pursuit theme.
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It's the Nahyuta agenda!

Good points, I prefer Casting magic too.
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The Pinnacle of DEAD

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After replaying 4-1 recently, I just have to gush on this case as a certain somene in it. This is going to be mostly on 4-1, but I'm also going to add a little on 4-4.

Right, 4-1. Where do I start? This is one of the best first cases in the series, and maybe cases, period. This was a bloody amazing introduction to the game in general. You start off as somene you don't know with some mentor you don't know. Let me talk about Kristoph's sprites for a moment.

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He appears very pleasant initially, and you can definitely see the resemblance to Mia's sprites here. He acts very much like the normal mentor figure to Apollo and helps ease him in. Then the trial starts, you see the good old judge and Payne's new hairdo (which actually looks great btw) and then the defendant is pulled in. Oh, and he's also Phoenix Wright.

This is one of my favourite parts about AJ, just the general dissonance created with the player. Just the way he looks and acts is so weird, so uncharacteristic of him but yet so intriguing. Then the testimony starts. Can I just say I love the cross examination theme of this game? It perfectly sets the mood of the game, especially this case, which takes place in a dark room deep underground with a shady past where a man was killing during a game of cards. I think it's perfect to play this in a cold air conditioned room to perfectly recreate the general atmosphere of this case.

Another thing I really love are the contradictions here. You really have to keep your eyes out for them, especially in this case. The first one is admittedly simple, but the second one needs you to point out two things in quick succession for the game to progress. Olga Orly is also a good witness and an even better red herring. She pretty much fits the bill of the average first killer, too.

But yes, the contradictions. The second one is also neat since it's math-involved and needs you to look at the chips carefully. The later ones are great though. Things like 'Wait, how did you see the blood on the victim's forehead if his hat was on?', and the contradiction involving the victim's hand. My personal favourite is the one involving the fingerprints on the grape juice bottle just because of how subtle it is. The reasoning with the bloody ace is also great because of just how much you could deduce from that. Plus, it was never really presented as evidence in the first place so its legality is certainly never brought up again.

I think this case really elevates itself at its second half, when the fourth person is revealed and Orly's innocence is established. Then when Kristoph is accused, all hell breaks loose. It's something you'd never expect, since you'd think he would just be Apollo's Mia the whole way through. Heck, he's even on the cover art. You'd never suspect him of being the tutorial villain.

I like Phoenix's second testimony just because of the sexual tension between the two during the entire thing. Kristoph being brought to the stand is also great because of the extremely tiny clues provided to it that you'd never notice on your first playthrough. I like how what brought him there in the first place is just him being a dumbass and waxing poetic about the back of the cards and the victim's head. Goddammit, Kristoph. But yeah, his actual testimony is pretty solid, seeing as the only 'contradiction' we manage to point out is involving just a hypothetical scenario that was just made by Phoenix. If it weren't not for that, the case would've ended right then and there.

Look at how Kristoph's expressions have changed, too.

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No longer the nice and wise mentor from the first part of the case, eh? But when he breaks down, you can really tell that he's stifling a lot of anger within. And when he just admits it and is escorted out, we're just left wondering what his motive was, who the victim was to him, what the locket means, and why Phoenix is as he is. It's absolutely jarring to the player and I love it.

And yeah, those are my feelings on the case, but I have to speak on Kristoph more.

The popular consensus is that he's a terrible villain because his motive for everything is just because he lost at poker. I vehemently disagree with that sentiment. Hell, I think that's what cements him as a solid villain in the first place. It's no more petty. to him than the penalty to Manfred was in DL-6. Think about it from his perspective. It all really started when Zak fired him as his Defense Attorney because he lost at poker.

The game tries pretty hard to justify this, but I think we all can agree that playing poker to determine who your lawyer will be is a pretty crappy idea, and you probably shouldn't do it if you want to have a chance at living. But then instead Zak- a world famous, extremely popular magician- instead foregoes Kristoph- who is seen as one of the best DAs of his time- for Phoenix Wright- who is seen as someone who uses just bluffs and guesses to win by many. In light of this, Kristoph (who had already forged some evidence, determined to win the case at first) goes to his brother and warns him not to trust Phoenix.

Then he spends years and years in paranoia that his forgery could be revealed, which really fits his character. At the end of it, Kristoph is- as Vera describes him- a devil. It's damn startling how his tone changes throughout the trial.

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These are his initial expressions, similar to those from 4-1.

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These are his later expressions, where he starts to get annoyed.

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And these are what I've eloquently termed the 'loosing his shit' expressions. Name says it all, really.

It's wonderful how you slowly but surely manage to break his façade to reveal the monster he truly is inside. Look at this:

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This is his 'confident' expression according to AA wiki, which he uses a bit in 4-1. But add a few lighting effects and KABOOM!

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It's downright frightening how such subtle a change can change his overall demeanour so much.

Admittedly, I will say that the final trial in 4-4 was a little bit short, but I don't think it really needed to be any longer, since a good deal of the plot was made pretty clear on the MASON system segment. But I love the way he's caught in the end- by the Jury System, something Phoenix orchestrated to catch him, as sweet sweet payback.

But yeah, that's all. I've rambled on a lot here, admittedly, but I really do love this case as well as its villain so ****ing much that I had to just gush about it. This game as well. AJ might as well be one of the best games in the series and it is a goddamn shame how underappreciated it is within the community. Maybe I should talk about it's later cases Moreno too, because I think they're also great. But that's really all that I have to say here, so…g'day!
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Wax Philosophical Power Hour

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I agree about his motive. It's not so much about the poker game, which was merely the catalyst, but rather about the underlying values like Kristoph's extreme sense of pride and self-importance that was hurt, and how he clearly sees Phoenix, who got to take over the defending, as "below" him. Just like Manfred killing Gregory wasn't so much "over a penalty" but because that penalty shattered his perfect score he'd been working so hard to achieve and valued so highly.
I also find it worthy of mention that the pokergame cost him the case where he'd gone to extreme lengths to ensure winning over the 17-year-old overly confident rookie who just so happens to be his brother.
Looking at his sprites I noticed he always seems to have his arms folded or at least one arm covering his upper body (except for when he's standing in court, which might be where he's in his element the most) and depending on context, facial expression etc it either can come across as confident, or like he's hiding/protecting himself or just losing it (his shit).
Image Like here where he's clutching his arm.
Image Or here where he seems to be struggling to, in every sense of the word, keep a grip on himself. In his final damage sprite his fingers look really distorted as well.

His body language and facial expressions are also quite interesting to compare to his brother's. They both have sweet smiles, and really pouty sour expressions when things don't go their way. They both have animations where they look away and flip their hair, but Kristoph does it when he's distressed and Klavier looks cocky (but also slightly nervous, at least to me). They both have a confident posture, but while Kristoph, as mentioned, has his arms folded in front of him, Klavier's body language is usually very open and relaxed, which suits their personalities - Kristoph distances himself from others and has secrets to hide, Klavier is open and laid-back (and a bit of a show-off). This is also seen in how Klavier usually looks straight ahead, making eye contact with the person he's talking or listening to (notable exception being the one where he tells off Kristoph and looks up instead, his hair covering his eyes), while Kristoph often has his glasses dimming his gaze, or his eyes closed, or looking away, or making eye contact but from below or above the players "eye-level". When Kristoph is at his cockiest, he looks at you from above (with or without creepy shadowing) - he looks down on you. Compare this to Klavier's sprite where he's bending himself over to keep eye contact - which might come across as a bit condescending to, but in a more playful/teasing way where he goes out of his way to -not- look down on you and instead confront you straight ahead. (I was just going to reply to some points about the last post... instead I ended up going on a tangent of my own xD Somehow I always end up talking about Klavier :klavier: )
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Frigging Klavier, man :p But yeah, it's kind of become tradition at this point for him to be the focus of this thread.

But yeah, I noticed that too. He seems to really like folding his hands a lot, and often tightens his grip on himself when he loses it.

In his final breakdown, his hands also freak out a lot:

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Especially in that last one, geez. It's like they're trying to curl into a fist but just not quite getting there. Oh, and this one also gets me:

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As you mentioned with Klavier, he's very open about himself and makes eye contact with whomever he talks to. But as we can see with Kristoph, he tries very hard not to make eye contact with anyone and in this sprite hides his face while laughing evilly. It's pretty interesting to speculate just what exactly he's laughing about here. Is it about the jurist system? Is it about getting caught? Who knows. I've actually read a theory somewhere that his breakdown and everything is actually his black Psyche Locks getting forcibly broken by Apollo, hence leading to him going insane, which would actually seemingly fit with DD's half-assed explanation. Interesting to think about, at least.
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Wax Philosophical Power Hour

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Quote:
Frigging Klavier, man :p

Ehehe~

Quote:
But yeah, it's kind of become tradition at this point for him to be the focus of this thread.

Indeed. :Hoboright:

Quote:
In his final breakdown, his hands also freak out a lot:

Such monster hands :o And so he loses his grip of himself and clutches at thin air... how deep.

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Especially in that last one, geez. It's like they're trying to curl into a fist but just not quite getting there.

Imagine the cramps he must have in the hands after that.

Quote:
It's pretty interesting to speculate just what exactly he's laughing about here. Is it about the jurist system? Is it about getting caught? Who knows.

Mm. I've always interpreted it as being about the jurist system because he seemed to think it was a fraud and a disgrace.

Quote:
I've actually read a theory somewhere that his breakdown and everything is actually his black Psyche Locks getting forcibly broken by Apollo, hence leading to him going insane, which would actually seemingly fit with DD's half-assed explanation. Interesting to think about, at least.

I like that theory too. And the one that at some point he started thinking he was completely justified in his actions.
What I'm curious about is how he fared after all of this. I once started reading a fanfiction about his life in prison but I never really bought that he'd still be so calm and calculated and... himself. I can't see how he'd ever go back to that after this breakdown.
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I was discussing this with someone yesterday, but Furio Tigre is a surprisingly intricate character. He's extremely ridiculous, but also pretty neat. He has a lot of parallels with Phoenix, but also some huge differences. They're both named after large beasts, both have spiky hair, and both have female sidekicks. They're also both pretty smart despite how dumb they look at first, if not a bit ridiculous. Phoenix comes up with reasonable scenarios while bluffing the hell out, while Furio comes up with an extremely intricate plan to frame Maggey using Kudo as a witness…but also goes to court wearing a cardboard badge pretending to be Phoenix.

And that's where the similarities end, surprisingly. In terms of design, Furio's contrasts Phoenix completely, and he's much more brutish. But when he's cornered, he goes all wimp and just pleads with the judge. For Phoenix, it's totally the other way around. He's totally meek normally, but when cornered he becomes much more courageous and goes for it. This is actually quite an interesting part of Furio's character. He uses brute force to achieve his goals, such as coercing Armstrong into his plan. But he's actually quite cowardly when it comes to the meat of it.

For example, he poisoned Elg. He didn't stab him or shoot him in an alleyway, but discreetly poisoned him. I find that fascinating, really, since it shows that despite his strong persona, he's quite cowardly in reality. That's also another parallel to Phoenix. He poisoned Glen Elg, just like Dahlia attempted to poison Phoenix. That's also why Phoenix hates him so much. Because he poisoned and betrayed two people, something he can never forgive. So yeah, the Tiger's quite interesting.
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I agree. He's a really absurd character and it would've been easy to leave him at that and he'd still be an entertaining villain, but even though he's one of the more "cartoonish" characters he's still not one-dimensional and I appreciate that. I also like that he rides a pink little scooter.
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The pink little scooter is the best. It doesn't complement him in the slightest and I love that. It's like Phoenix's ringtone, actually.
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