Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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BonnyMono wrote:
I don't know if I am the only who thinks this but...
Spoiler: 2-4 and 5-5
.gif)
Spoiler:
"Descole? You don't mean Mr. I-Like-to-Wreck-Things-with-Mechanical-Monsters-and-Dress-Up-as-Posh-Ladies Descole?" -Emmy Altava
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Adrian in black wrote:
BonnyMono wrote:
I don't know if I am the only who thinks this but...
Spoiler: 2-4 and 5-5
Spoiler:
Well, prehaps I phrased it wrong. I was only talking about the recycled animation, I didn't mean that they have some sort of connection.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Spoiler: GS5 case 5 bad ending
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Jozerick wrote:
I was thinking...
Spoiler: GS5 case 5 bad ending
Spoiler: 5-5
"Oh holy father, holy Brother, holy master... My sacred mission is at last complete. With these two hands, mankind is saved. I am your will made flesh. In your name, I give thanks."
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Spoiler: 5-5
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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BonnyMono wrote:
Adrian in black wrote:
BonnyMono wrote:
I don't know if I am the only who thinks this but...
Spoiler: 2-4 and 5-5
Spoiler:
Well, prehaps I phrased it wrong. I was only talking about the recycled animation, I didn't mean that they have some sort of connection.
Haha, sorry. I guess I can't resist a good old fashioned crazy twist.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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They could have put an "android athena" twist in near the end of 5-5, and if they pulled it off right, they would have salvaged the entire game.
At some point, they should have pulled Athena up onto the stand to testify about her mother's murder. And Athena gives a really... weird testimony. Phoenix eventually begins to feel like he's heard this sort of thing before. And then he realizes... the thing that could explain Athena's testimony... It's because Athena is just like...! *Present Plonco/Clonco* BECAUSE ATHENA IS AN ANDROID AND FOLLOWS THE SAME RULES FOR HER TESTIMONY AS THEIRS.
Obviously you couldn't just turn Athena into an android and retain the rest of the case exactly as-is, but I feel like if they had done this, they would have both salvaged Athena's character (by explaining how she's so super-special-awesome) and made the last cast not as bad, by giving it a really wow twist, which I think would've been enough.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
they would have both salvaged Athena's character (by explaining how she's so super-special-awesome)
That's... quite clear by now it's pretty subjective matter.
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Spoiler:
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
No, no, BP. You're looking at it the wrong way. The public's faith in the legal system consists of celebrity names. Who cares about those guys who just show up one game and disappear in the next?
...This universe is so askew.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Since DD was - if I recall correctly - being marketed as somewhat of a jumping-in point for new players, could it be that the game designers included the whole Dark Age theme as a way to "explain" why the justice system is as messed up as it is? (Alongside it being used as a way to make the game ~darker~ and ~edgier~, of course.) I'm not saying they pulled it off particularly well, but still. Actually, I'd be interested to hear the opinion of someone who played DD before the other games, but I doubt many people on CR have.
Maybe I'm thinking too hard about this, especially since they didn't bother to do anything like that for the earlier games, obviously.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
...
Spoiler:
No but seriously, I wonder why I never thought about that...granted, the whole "Dark Age of the Law" is so poorly handled and full of holes so I guess I just didn't care enough. Still, good catch.
Spoiler:
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
迷探偵
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Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
Actually, faith in the legal system is restored by
Spoiler:
"One dumbbell, Watson! Consider an athlete with one dumbbell! Picture to yourself the unilateral development, the imminent danger of a spinal curvature. Shocking, Watson, shocking!" - The Valley of Fear
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
Wait a minute... Did they even state WHEN the Dark Age of the Law started? As far as I know, every AA game shows something that the law has been screwing up. (I guess.)
"Oh holy father, holy Brother, holy master... My sacred mission is at last complete. With these two hands, mankind is saved. I am your will made flesh. In your name, I give thanks."
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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BonnyMono wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
Wait a minute... Did they even state WHEN the Dark Age of the Law started? As far as I know, every AA game shows something that the law has been screwing up. (I guess.)
It's repeatedly stated that it started after both Phoenix and Blackquill committed their supposed crimes. They even talk with each other about it in 5-5, and vow to bring an end to it together.
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Ash wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
Actually, faith in the legal system is restored by
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
While I did simplify things a tiny bit in my first post about this, I don't think adding the proper detail actually changes it when you think about it.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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I'll keep saying this until I'm blue in the face but the Gavin story should have been a part of GS5. They already had a plot to build on, why so much resetting? They still could have made it accessible to new players in the same way the State vs Blackquill case was made accessible to us even though it technically didn't "happen" when we played the game.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
While I did simplify things a tiny bit in my first post about this, I don't think adding the proper detail actually changes it when you think about it.
Spoiler:
"One dumbbell, Watson! Consider an athlete with one dumbbell! Picture to yourself the unilateral development, the imminent danger of a spinal curvature. Shocking, Watson, shocking!" - The Valley of Fear
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Sligneris wrote:
It wouldn't be accessible, as the new players would then start GS4 knowing everything that happened.
I'm guessing that's his point. The story suffered because they wanted to appeal to newcomers.
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Thane wrote:
Sligneris wrote:
It wouldn't be accessible, as the new players would then start GS4 knowing everything that happened.
I'm guessing that's his point. The story suffered because they wanted to appeal to newcomers.
(her) And yeah-- Why is Capcom suddenly so mortified at mentioning plot points from previous games? It didn't make one iota of difference to them in GS1-3. It's like refusing to mention plot points from the first book when writing a sequel... No author ever does that, yet people still start series out of order. It's not a huge deal in that regard for most creators.
How many times have you seen the sequel to a movie that essentially told you the plot of the first movie, but still watched it anyway? It happens.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Ash wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
While I did simplify things a tiny bit in my first post about this, I don't think adding the proper detail actually changes it when you think about it.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
@Cravat of Doom: While it may be okay in general, refusing to give out plot points like that in a mystery is something I can understand, even if I agree that it sometimes feels like it ends up constraining the franchise a bit too much.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
@Cravat of Doom: While it may be okay in general, refusing to give out plot points like that in a mystery is something I can understand, even if I agree that it sometimes feels like it ends up constraining the franchise a bit too much.
"One dumbbell, Watson! Consider an athlete with one dumbbell! Picture to yourself the unilateral development, the imminent danger of a spinal curvature. Shocking, Watson, shocking!" - The Valley of Fear
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
1000% Knight
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Ash wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
@Cravat of Doom: While it may be okay in general, refusing to give out plot points like that in a mystery is something I can understand, even if I agree that it sometimes feels like it ends up constraining the franchise a bit too much.
I get the feeling we have differing views about exactly how much the public is going to find out.
Spoiler:
...I think we're going to just need to wrap this up into "agree to disagree" pretty soon
I don't think there's really much to 'back up' either side.
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Quote:
I'd like to know a little more about the dark age of the law.
Manfred von Karma, Damon Gant, Lana Skye, head of the Prosecutorial Investigation Committee, Kristoph Gavin and Chief Justice. All of them were respected, influential in the world of law high-profile individuals who operated for years. All of them corrupt, engaged in illegal activities. Most of them being murderers as well.
Why neither of them (excluding for obvious reasons Gavin and Chief Justice) started such a dark age, but a rookie prosecutor and a constantly bluffing attorney did?
I always wondered that, until I saw that article heading in one of the newspapers. "The Samurai's Honor Restored: Simon Blackquill, just as Phoenix Wright, finally proven innocent". The word "finally" surprised me. It's like the author believed they were innocent. The rest of the article confirmed my expectations.
That sort of opened up the possibility to me. Which is exactly the question I'd like to ask, as I am not that well informed with the public opinion, myself: Was the reason for the dark age of the law the fact that Blackquill and Wright supposedly committed their crimes, or was it - I quote - because of the "clumsily handled" trial of theirs? As I looked up to their cases, it would be right, because - as lately revealed - there was a massive cover-up for Blackquill case (along with the footage apparently not investigated/reported properly) and investigation of Wright's disbarment was incomplete to say the least.
Manfred von Karma, Damon Gant, Lana Skye, head of the Prosecutorial Investigation Committee, Kristoph Gavin and Chief Justice. All of them were respected, influential in the world of law high-profile individuals who operated for years. All of them corrupt, engaged in illegal activities. Most of them being murderers as well.
Why neither of them (excluding for obvious reasons Gavin and Chief Justice) started such a dark age, but a rookie prosecutor and a constantly bluffing attorney did?
I always wondered that, until I saw that article heading in one of the newspapers. "The Samurai's Honor Restored: Simon Blackquill, just as Phoenix Wright, finally proven innocent". The word "finally" surprised me. It's like the author believed they were innocent. The rest of the article confirmed my expectations.
That sort of opened up the possibility to me. Which is exactly the question I'd like to ask, as I am not that well informed with the public opinion, myself: Was the reason for the dark age of the law the fact that Blackquill and Wright supposedly committed their crimes, or was it - I quote - because of the "clumsily handled" trial of theirs? As I looked up to their cases, it would be right, because - as lately revealed - there was a massive cover-up for Blackquill case (along with the footage apparently not investigated/reported properly) and investigation of Wright's disbarment was incomplete to say the least.
This is going to be part of my letter to Edgeworth on Ask Ace Attorney, which sort of imposes my own headcanon, but I guess that is not a problem as it's addressed to as speculation and just one, single in-universe newspaper...
That is my theory regarding DAotL theme, anyway.
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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SuperSega360 wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
"Oh holy father, holy Brother, holy master... My sacred mission is at last complete. With these two hands, mankind is saved. I am your will made flesh. In your name, I give thanks."
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Sligneris wrote:
How do you imagine him in high school?
It makes sense if you think deeply about it. Perhaps the people he was impersonating were bullying him and decided to remove his own identity and impersonate the one who was bullying.
...
UNNECESSARY LOGIC IS FUN!
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Spoiler:
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Sowl16 wrote:
So i just finished the first case, i have so much trouble going on because there's a gaping hole in the plot to my understanding.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
"Descole? You don't mean Mr. I-Like-to-Wreck-Things-with-Mechanical-Monsters-and-Dress-Up-as-Posh-Ladies Descole?" -Emmy Altava
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Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
"I'm so sick of Khura'in!"
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Bad Player wrote:
Y'know, I realized last night that in DD, we end The Dark Age of Law by clearing the names of Nick (in AJ) and Blackquill. In other words, we restore the public's faith in the legal system by...
Spoiler:
Baaahahaha *facepalm* "Teh Dark Aeg of Laew" is such a poorly handled plotline x)
This is the Dark Age of the Ace Attorney
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9unMpCcQpA
Phoenix mentions the one responsible for the courtroom bombing is the Phantom. We don't know that yet. I'm glad I missed that or didn't think much of it my first time through. The game spoiled itself
Re: GS5 Spoiler Discussion
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Some of this terrible writing leaking out to the one line during the recess part is not really surprising, and I really don't mind that much... Not with this screw-up of the finale.
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