Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Epilogue : Berry Big Circus

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sat Mar 27, 2021 9:47 pm

JesusMonroe

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“Keep in mind that when a statement was said matters—it’s valid if it was a truth at the time. I’d also like to highlight Jolina’s first purple statement in part 6– ‘responsible’ is ambiguous as well.” Gideon pointed out. “But I’ll at the very least confirm only one character lies with their statements to make things simpler.”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sat Mar 27, 2021 10:14 pm

Collin1002

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"And the 'character' that's lying about their statements would be the culprit, correct?" Erik questioned. "And regarding the Detektiv's pistol, would we have been able to tell the difference between the wounds? The bullets from a rifle would look different than ones from a pistol, but what about the wounds themselves?"

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sat Mar 27, 2021 10:16 pm

JesusMonroe

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“Only the culprit can lie, so yes. And even the wounds make the type of gun ambiguous, since the wound from a single gun can vary based on distance and angle. In short nobody could tell.”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 12:10 am

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"It's a minor thing, but as Meta was a victim, anything she said is akin to red truth," Verrier pointed out. "Meta's murder is troublesome, though. If there's only one killer (which has been confirmed in red), and everyone in the known group outside of Edna can vouch for each other for that murder (which is confirmed true as two people said as much), it's difficult to see an alternative to Edna doing it. Perhaps... this is the impossible crime?"

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 3:41 am

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“Am I really the only one who cares that I’m actively dying right now?” Fritz asked, “I guess we’re all used to it, but...damn. It stings.”

Fritz shook his head and then refocused his attention on the game part of the game.

KamiPanda wrote:

"Meta's murder is troublesome, though. If there's only one killer (which has been confirmed in red), and everyone in the known group outside of Edna can vouch for each other for that murder (which is confirmed true as two people said as much), it's difficult to see an alternative to Edna doing it. Perhaps... this is the impossible crime?"

“I’m not even sure if there is an impossible crime anymore,” Fritz replied, “But I think there could be a way to explain this. Meta was shot earlier, and Edna moved her to the garden while everyone had an alibi. It’s not clear from Jolina’s statement if everyone has an alibi from Meta’s murder onward or from the moment Edna went missing, and Edna could probably be convinced to perform a trick like that.”

“While I’d hate to point fingers, there is something I’d like to add,” Fritz says, “The mysteries become child’s play if you are the culprit, Verrier. Assuming you lied about every victim being dead, you could have killed them after the locked rooms were opened. In that case, Edna would have injured them—or made them appear to be injured—but not fatally.”

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Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:46 am

JesusMonroe

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“That would count as cooperation, Fritz. But if you’re prepared to acknowledge Edna as a culprit, then by all means! Thank you for listening!” Gideon cheered. “The only thing I have left to add is none of these final incidents are impossible, if we wish to make it easier to think about.”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:32 am

KamiPanda

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Planetbox wrote:

“I’m not even sure if there is an impossible crime anymore,” Fritz replied, “But I think there could be a way to explain this. Meta was shot earlier, and Edna moved her to the garden while everyone had an alibi. It’s not clear from Jolina’s statement if everyone has an alibi from Meta’s murder onward or from the moment Edna went missing, and Edna could probably be convinced to perform a trick like that.”

“While I’d hate to point fingers, there is something I’d like to add,” Fritz says, “The mysteries become child’s play if you are the culprit, Verrier. Assuming you lied about every victim being dead, you could have killed them after the locked rooms were opened. In that case, Edna would have injured them—or made them appear to be injured—but not fatally.”

"By its very definition, 'alibi' applies to the time Meta was killed," Verrier pointed out. "If everyone else has an alibi, then they are accounted for during Meta's murder.

"It is, of course, difficult to refute your accusation though. Heinrich's murder has been confirmed by Christof as well, at least, and it's clear that you yourself are still alive, though barely. For the other two it's a valid theory for now, though I deny it.

"There seems to be a simple solution to Fritz's locked room: Fritz, after being shot, locked himself in. Trying to defend himself from the killer, I'd imagine."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:09 am

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[changed wording of one of Jolina’s purples—“responsible” -> “primarily responsible”]

“Fritz did not lock the door to the master bedroom—this includes before and after being shot.”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 12:20 pm

KamiPanda

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"I was rather hoping to get a 'Fritz could not move after being shot', but alas," Verrier lamented. "We discovered the 4 crimes in a certain order, but the first three could have occurred in any order, which is something to keep in mind. Additionally, any of the victims could also be perpetrators of previous crimes. I was mistaken about the 'single culprit' idea, so for example, Heinrich could have shot Fritz, and then Meta could have killed Heinrich.

"Cici's murder is quite difficult. I cannot tell why anyone would move the fridge to block the door, when they could just as easily have locked it from the same side. If Agnes is the liar though, there's a chance the other doors weren't locked, making the closed room trivial. So far it's the only solution I can see."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:16 pm

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Edna shook her head. "I'm not sure what kind of mystery this is, Giddy. I know I didn't do any of this. And given how much purple Jolina had, especially when accusing me, it really can only be her, yes? She already has demonstrated she has expertise using the rifle. Since I took it away from her, she got revenge by knocking out the good detektiv, using his gun to shoot Fritz and then commit the other murders and then frame them all on me. Quite simple, yes?"

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 7:56 pm

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“Perhaps. But I’d rather make this simple for everyone to remove all doubt—all of Jolina’s purple statements are true. Perhaps you can say she earned a brief detective status for a chapter.” Gideon chuckled. It seemed that this could’ve been his plan all along.

[Scene Music]

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:44 pm

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"Well, that does rather simplify things. I'm not really sure how to proceed from here though, I must admit. All I've got is Fritz killed Meta. He shot her with the rifle, then left it by her body where Edna picked it up. He has no alibi but wasn't present at the scene, so slips past Jolina's purple truth about that crime."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:53 pm

JesusMonroe

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“It is my mistake to put Verrier at the scene of Meta’s death, not attending to Fritz. But the purple statement still holds. At the time of Meta’s shooting and death, the following people had an alibi—Agnes, Fritz, Verrier, Christof, Jolina, Angelo. They all verified each other’s collectively.”

Last edited by JesusMonroe on Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 8:57 pm

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"What about Angelo?" Verrier asked.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 9:05 pm

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“Oh of course.” Stupid GM. “I have amended it.”

Weird. Like it didn’t happen.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 10:52 pm

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"Oh, I just remembered..." Fritz remarked suddenly. "After Gideon died, I occasionally used Agnes drafts or ideas for episodes of the show. They were actually quite good, so they kept the network satisfied. I'd say some of her mysteries even rival her father's."

It was unclear why Fritz brought this up, possibly inviting further criticism. Perhaps it was relevant somehow...

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Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Sun Mar 28, 2021 11:33 pm

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"...Well, who am I to judge," Verrier responded non-judgementally. "That does bring up an interesting possibility, though. You were, somehow, responsible for Agnes seeing Gideon after his death. You're an actor, I'm sure a disguise can be achieved one way or another. You asked Agnes for copies of her drafts. She even noticed that Gideon only ever visited her for her stories, and never went to Geistfabel to meet Edna. And if this is true, it wouldn't be much of a stretch to assume you were the same Gideon Agnes saw during the story, the one who gave her the card."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:19 am

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Spoiler: Hints

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:46 am

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Edelfäule snorts, not amused by these new mysteries. She pours herself half-and-half Red Bull and tea, and makes her way to her seat, her rose hair flowing behind her.

She kicks up her clawed feet, "The culprit in Cici's murder hid in the fridge and therefore was not found when the scene was investigated. Look, I solved it. And all it took was thinking like a piss-addled slop-eater. What would I do to put a dumbass closed room in the middle of gripping intrigue?"

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:26 pm

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"I'll be nice and say nobody was hiding in the fridge, but I'm not going to respond to every little blue with the ultimate goal of you all just confirming purple statements. There should be things that should be figured out already." Gideon instructed. "That being said, the inside of the fridge was a bit... messy. It wouldn't be wise to hide inside."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:52 pm

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"I must admit, I'm still struggling. There's a lot of information to process, yet at the same time nothing concrete to start from. I'm not sure how to proceed," Verrier said. "One of Jolina's statements caught my interest, at least:

'We’ve found handwriting samples as old as 19 years that match exactly... If someone wrote his letters for him, [Edna is] the only one left who could’ve had the opportunity.'

"'The only one left' leaves room for any of the victims to also have done it. Meta or one of Gideon's siblings in particular seem likely. I'm not sure which would have been close to Gideon often enough to be his letter-writer though. Meta seems the best candidate, but that's really only an educated guess, not a deduction. It's reasonable that one of the conspirators behind covering up Gideon's death was someone who could 'forge' his letters at least."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 4:33 pm

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KamiPanda wrote:

"...Well, who am I to judge," Verrier responded non-judgementally. "That does bring up an interesting possibility, though. You were, somehow, responsible for Agnes seeing Gideon after his death. You're an actor, I'm sure a disguise can be achieved one way or another. You asked Agnes for copies of her drafts. She even noticed that Gideon only ever visited her for her stories, and never went to Geistfabel to meet Edna. And if this is true, it wouldn't be much of a stretch to assume you were the same Gideon Agnes saw during the story, the one who gave her the card."

“I had nothing to do with that,” Fritz replied, “Perhaps my costume designer could have made me look like Gideon, but I wasn’t about to tangle her up into this. Perhaps someone was disguised as Gideon, but I didn’t know anything about it.”

“I do recall that while Gideon was alive, sometimes he would be seen without the headship ring. I’d just like to confirm something. Gideon had a secret body double.”

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Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 4:46 pm

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“There are no body doubles. I think rather than suggesting that the person Agnes saw looked like Gideon, it’s more productive to think she simply ‘recognized them as Gideon’. But if you claim to know nothing perhaps we really will be stuck in here forever...”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:45 pm

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"You make it sound like Agnes had prosopagnosia," Verrier observed.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:59 pm

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“No, no. Nothing quite like that. She unfortunately isn’t here to testify, but I think the conspirators can fill in any blanks you have regardless.”

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:23 pm

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"We need to keep in mind that the scene we saw was written from Agnes's perspective," Fritz remarked, "As I said, I wasn't made aware of any tricks we pulled to make a fake Gideon who could interact with his family, which makes me suspect that this never happened. It sounds more like Agnes simply perceived someone as Gideon in her head, for reasons I don't quite understand. Perhaps that would explain her seeing Gideon around dinnertime as well."

"We had assigned Meta the task of obtaining scripts and stories from Agnes...so does that mean Agnes was seeing Meta as Gideon? Is she the one behind all this? Verrier already theorized that she could have been the one writing Gideon's letters..."

"Alternatively, could that person be Angelo? He was the only one who wasn't at dinner, after all."

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Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:39 pm

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"I had wondered if Meta killed the other conspirators. I'm not quite sure what the motive would be, just that she is in a position to have a motive for those specific murders," Verrier said. "And then Edna killed her, putting an end to it. Edna is a 'culprit' and also the one liar, meaning she was mistaken about the keys always being by her side. This would explain how the closed rooms were done."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Mon Mar 29, 2021 11:06 pm

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“The key never left Edna’s side.” Gideon announced, breaking his earlier rule. It was because this red still implicated Edna, an outcome that was more than likely as long as Verrier’s blind spot remained.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 12:06 am

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Verrier had a brainwave after studying the purple statements for the umpteenth time. "Lynde killed Meta. He has the fourth, unaccounted-for gun. Jolina said he hadn't killed anyone, but that statement doesn't apply to Meta's murder which happened afterwards."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 2:09 am

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“...” Gideon’s smile contorted into one of frustration, but he refused to budge an inch. “And what of it? Edna was still the only one in the room with Fritz. And the crime is impossible regardless of anybody else lying.”

It seems some ground was being made, even if Gideon wouldn’t acknowledge it.

[Scene Music]

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 2:58 am

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Harley have been quiet for a while as he listens to what was going on.

"Are we absolutely sure the detective's gun never left his side? What about the rifle Edna confiscated from Jolina? It never left her side?" Harley asked, an eyebrow raised. "Meta was killed outside in the garden... Which means that Lynde is still somewhere out there. And for deaths before Meta's, they were killed by a gun. The only guns that could have been used in those murders were... Jolina's rifle, which was confiscated by Edna, and the detective's gun."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 5:12 am

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JesusMonroe wrote:

“...” Gideon’s smile contorted into one of frustration, but he refused to budge an inch. “And what of it? Edna was still the only one in the room with Fritz. And the crime is impossible regardless of anybody else lying.”

It seems some ground was being made, even if Gideon wouldn’t acknowledge it.

"Struggle more, bitch," Edelfäule sneers, slamming down her tea and Red Bull. "Maybe if you hadn't debased yourself, sucking the toes of these closed room tricks, your mystery would have entertained for an eternity more."

"It's not too late for you to sign your legacy over to me, or do you wish to wither in this husk of a story and character?"

She waits a second for Gideon's response, but in her head she is already trying to brush away the next mystery so that he will bow to her more. "The killer shot Fritz through a wall, meaning there was no need to enter the locked room."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 12:00 pm

KamiPanda

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"The killer shot Fritz through the still-open door while he was talking with Edna. Edna then locked herself inside the room with him to protect herself, before falling unconscious due to a drug already in her system," Verrier said, though he didn't seem particularly confident now that he'd said it aloud.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 4:33 pm

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"The walls are too thick for a bullet to pass through." Gideon said, though his demeanor was clearly a bit more panicked. "I can't think of a specific enough red to counter your theory, Doctor. But I will at least say that the killer did not shoot through the doorway or the window."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 7:46 pm

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"Then perhaps the killer shot Fritz through the floor, or ceiling," Verrier suggested. "Maybe Edna wasn't the only one drugged. By drugging Fritz too, the killer would know where he was in the room. This would also put him on the floor, which is the angle needed to fire a shot through his throat from above or below."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 8:03 pm

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Gideon recoiled, biting his lips. It was like he was trying to think of the red to say, but ultimately he calmed his breathing.

[Scene Music]

"None of this matters, unfortunately. Even setting aside Cici's death, Edna is the only person who could've turned the lock in the dining room at midnight." It seemed Gideon was willing to stake everything on this mystery. "There's nothing else to it--Edna is the killer by that alone."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Tue Mar 30, 2021 8:55 pm

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"Edna is the only one who could have turned the lock in the dining room?" Harley asked before he burst out laughing. "Come on, Gideon, you're excluding two suspects from the list; Agnes and Jolina. Either Edna, Agnes or Jolina could have done it."

"And if Edna is the mastermind like we suspected her to be... Then there's a problem with that... How would she knows what a eviscerated corpse looks like and how to make it looks so real? Recall that Julia and I were involved in the prank to trick the others into thinking we were killed... But that prank backfired when I was gassed to death and Julia was fatally stabbed."

"... Thinking about it now, a corpse being eviscerated sounds like something out of a script or maybe a locked room mystery story. And Fritz here said that he hired the lawyer to collect scripts and stories from Agnes." It sounds like Harley was accusing Agnes of committing the crimes.

"Gideon, give me one good reason why your daughter, my niece, cannot be the mastermind." The mechanic demanded as he stares at Gideon.

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Wed Mar 31, 2021 3:09 am

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"As I already said in red, they were not in the mansion at the time the dining room was locked." Gideon explained. "Is that a good enough reason?"

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:20 am

JaytheBluPirate

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"I suppose it does." Harley said, agreeing with Gideon for one thing. "But the culprit could have unlocked the door at midnight. Speaking of which..."

Harley flips through his copy of Ghost Fables before getting to a specific page. "Here, the dining room door have a sound that sounds out when it is being unlocked/locked. It lets out a loud CLICK, and this lock is the loudest one in the mansion..." The mechanic explains before he flips through the book again before getting to the end of the book.

"And in this section of the book... During the discovery of Uncle Henrich's murder, Meta said, and I quote, 'some of the rooms are reasonably soundproof--I’m not surprised we couldn’t hear something as loud as a gunshot or perhaps louder.'..." He points out. "I believe we should talk about the soundproof rooms next. Gideon, if you would kindly please tell us which of the rooms in the mansions are reasonably soundproof."

Re: Ghost Fables ~ Dead Thread Final Chapter

Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:51 am

JesusMonroe

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“The ‘soundproof’ clue is only relevant for the final murders. Therefore just the scullery, servant’s quarters, and master bedroom. It’s not relevant to the dining room incident.”