Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Bramimond wrote:
One does not simply
Change a country's legal system.
You won the internet for me. :D
Hmmm, but looking at it...
First person to pop up in my head was Dahlia to be honest - purple color, butterfly, even that flying - let's call it "thing" (since we don't know what is it for real and my English is really poor. xD) behind the person would somehow fit - the only problem here is that she is dead (and she is no prosecutor nor has the connection with Appolo).
Buuuuut.... considering the fact that this game is taking a place in Kurain Kingdom, where you can see the last moments of dead in the courtroom by the Water Mirror and it seems like a fantastical twist is stronger than in previous games...
can there be involved a channeling maybe? Or something like that?
...Okay, my fantasy is running wild. This is impossible. Somebody stop me please. :D
Aynway I'm really curious to see who is this character going to be - if a new one or older. And I can't wait for the game, it looks fantastic. :)
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
Y'know
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If there are no 'sides' to clash and every case is pretty much open-and-shut with the magic mirror telling them everything, all you need is the oracle and the judge to pass verdict based on that, right?
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Nearavex wrote:
The whole "there are no attorneys in this country" is kinda cheesy though - I mean in this case, what's the use for prosecutors either? Why do they even have defense attorney bench just waiting for someone to take it?
If there are no 'sides' to clash and every case is pretty much open-and-shut with the magic mirror telling them everything, all you need is the oracle and the judge to pass verdict based on that, right?
If there are no 'sides' to clash and every case is pretty much open-and-shut with the magic mirror telling them everything, all you need is the oracle and the judge to pass verdict based on that, right?
See, you just pointed out why this entire premise doesn't work to begin with.
C-A
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Nearavex wrote:
The whole "there are no attorneys in this country" is kinda cheesy though - I mean in this case, what's the use for prosecutors either? Why do they even have defense attorney bench just waiting for someone to take it?
If there are no 'sides' to clash and every case is pretty much open-and-shut with the magic mirror telling them everything, all you need is the oracle and the judge to pass verdict based on that, right?
If there are no 'sides' to clash and every case is pretty much open-and-shut with the magic mirror telling them everything, all you need is the oracle and the judge to pass verdict based on that, right?
On the surface, it sounds stupid, yes.
However, during the demo footage they previewed at TGS 2015, there's one point Eshiro brings up during the cross-examination. He said that the people of this country "don't trust defense attorneys". Which is to say, they used to have some, but over time, such people became known as the lowest of the low. To be compared to a defense attorney is a terrible insult. Eventually, people simply stopped trying to become DAs, and there came to be none in the entire country. It would then be left up to the judge and oracle to decide verdicts.
It does explain why Phoenix doesn't simply introduce himself as a defense attorney and first asks where Bokto's is. Whether that was something Bokto advised him or whatnot, who knows. Nonetheless, Phoenix ends up as his defense anyway, since he couldn't stand around doing nothing.
So, what about the prosecutors? They're still in charge of handling these kinds of cases, so yes, there's still a demand for them. Naturally, there would also be a detective who will star in this game. It'll probably be someone new, though.
As for Payne... nah, I'm not justifying it. He's there because he's there.
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
Y'know
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On a side note, I'm guessing Gaspen got fired by Edgeworth back in LA, huh? Once again playing the role of a big bully, though.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
Y'know
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I mean, just look at him, and then at his defendants.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Nearavex wrote:
I referred to Gaspen being the big bully, actually.
I mean, just look at him, and then at his defendants.
I mean, just look at him, and then at his defendants.
He only had one that we know of...and yes, I agree, but at least he's deserving of his "Rookie Killer/Humiliator or whatever it was" title, as he actually almost beat Athena, and even Phoenix if the other hadn't been there.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
Y'know
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Also, pretty sure Winston wasn't that bad in Turnabout Memories.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Nearavex wrote:
I'd say the biggest difference is that in spite of his arrogance, Winston was likeable. Gaspen is just funny, I guess.
Also, pretty sure Winston wasn't that bad in Turnabout Memories.
Also, pretty sure Winston wasn't that bad in Turnabout Memories.
Winston's meant to represent the stock and standard lawyer, who would be completely out of his mind when dealing with the whacky cases and defense lawyers that appear before him.
Gaspen's just another whacky character. An excuse to have another Payne as the 1st prosecutor. But it does mean that this way he's been shoehorned off to Kurain, so if he no longer appears, there's an explanation XD
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Kircheis wrote:
Bramimond wrote:
One does not simply
Change a country's legal system.
You won the internet for me. :D
Hmmm, but looking at it...
First person to pop up in my head was Dahlia to be honest - purple color, butterfly, even that flying - let's call it "thing" (since we don't know what is it for real and my English is really poor. xD) behind the person would somehow fit - the only problem here is that she is dead (and she is no prosecutor nor has the connection with Appolo).
Buuuuut.... considering the fact that this game is taking a place in Kurain Kingdom, where you can see the last moments of dead in the courtroom by the Water Mirror and it seems like a fantastical twist is stronger than in previous games...
can there be involved a channeling maybe? Or something like that?
...Okay, my fantasy is running wild. This is impossible. Somebody stop me please. :D
Aynway I'm really curious to see who is this character going to be - if a new one or older. And I can't wait for the game, it looks fantastic. :)
Since there are channelers it is possible that she be summoned but so far every time a trailer for an Ace Attorney game has shown a character in silhouette it has been a character first introduced in that game (Gotot, Kristoph Gavin, Simon Blackquill). I also doubt that they would have a character not seen since Trials and Tribulations such a major role as the villain and even if they wanted to go that route I see Morgan Fey as being the better choice since she has a more direct connection to the channeling technique.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
Y'know
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SuperAj3 wrote:
Winston's meant to represent the stock and standard lawyer, who would be completely out of his mind when dealing with the whacky cases and defense lawyers that appear before him.
I'd say that it has changed somewhat in T&T and AJ, no?
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Nearavex wrote:
On a side note, I'm guessing Gaspen got fired by Edgeworth back in LA, huh? Once again playing the role of a big bully, though.
There was a joke in the special court that basically had Phoenix say as much. It IS the fourth-wall-breaking special court, so I dunno how viable it is a source of info for stuff like this, but all the same.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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I know who the prosecutor is!
Of course the only one is....Iny
Spoiler:
*announce the truth*
Isn't it obvious? Look what we have.
These are the pictures we got from the TGS video.
And this is Ini's artwork.
Spoiler:
As you can see, both have a hat, both have a strange pose
Spoiler:
.gif)
.gif)
Both have a BUTTERFLY. GUYS the Butterfly.
And Ini's story is related to Kurain Village and spirits...
Which proves that SHE'S THE PROSECUTOR.
.
.
.
Spoiler:
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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iKiwed wrote:
HOLD IT!
I know who the prosecutor is!
Of course the only one is....Iny Miney!
*announce the truth*
Isn't it obvious? Look what we have.
These are the pictures we got from the TGS video.
And this is Ini's artwork.
As you can see, both have a hat, both have a strange pose
Both have a BUTTERFLY. GUYS the Butterfly.
And Ini's story is related to Kurain Village and spirits...
Which proves that SHE'S THE PROSECUTOR.
.
.
.
I know who the prosecutor is!
Of course the only one is....Iny
Spoiler:
*announce the truth*
Isn't it obvious? Look what we have.
These are the pictures we got from the TGS video.
And this is Ini's artwork.
Spoiler:
As you can see, both have a hat, both have a strange pose
Spoiler:
Both have a BUTTERFLY. GUYS the Butterfly.
And Ini's story is related to Kurain Village and spirits...
Which proves that SHE'S THE PROSECUTOR.
.
.
.
Spoiler:
I knew the Illuminati were behind this.
I've heard rumors… Bramimond, one of the eight legends, devoted himself entirely to the dark. All emotion, all memory… dissolved in a river of dark. That is how he received the power to best dragons
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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SuperAj3 wrote:
So I increased the saturation on that silhouette and it came up with this:
This is the silhouette traced over:
Is that flowing material going behind their head from their wrist? And it looks like they've either not drawn in the hair or this person's bald. I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say this is... Winston Payne! Maybe? Will Payne be formidable this time? I mean, how else could Gaspen become so well clad with a crown and a sash with the first part of his name in Kanji written all over it?
Spoiler: large image
This is the silhouette traced over:
Is that flowing material going behind their head from their wrist? And it looks like they've either not drawn in the hair or this person's bald. I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say this is... Winston Payne! Maybe? Will Payne be formidable this time? I mean, how else could Gaspen become so well clad with a crown and a sash with the first part of his name in Kanji written all over it?
I think that's a tight hood...Makes more sense then the person being bald.
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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I don't think this person is bald, it's what they want we think (Skullface announced in Ace Attorney?). What about a tuft that covers the right side of his/her face?
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Quote:
He said that the people of this country "don't trust defense attorneys".
So it's just like Japanifornia's court system.
Quote:
They're still in charge of handling these kinds of cases, so yes, there's still a demand for them.
How!? It really sounds like everyone gathers, says, "(Person) is said to have committed (crime), what say you, O'Great Mirror Of Decisions?" and then stares at the mirror, until it inadvertedly says 'Guitly' (because nobody in these game is ever declared Not Guilty until we save the day) and then everyone goes home, except the defendant who gets the death penalty or what-not.
Quote:
The detectives would still be needed to gather evidence, no doubt.
Why?! Does the mirror actually care about evidence? It's a freaking mirror (whether sentient or sapient or nothing is not fully clear), they don't care about whatever flimsy evidence was brought up.
C-A
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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In the end, it doesn't matter why these elements are there, because the plot needs them for itself to exist. The bad guys don't kill the heroes when it seems convenient because the plot. Or, to put in Ace Attorney terms; The defence bench is there because the plot. The prosecutor exists because the plot. These are the expected basic elements of an Ace Attorney game, and thus how the murder mystery is... well... demystified (two attorneys toss theories and testimony until a judge is sufficiently convinced), so that's how it goes. It doesn't need to actually make complete perfect sense as to why the prosecutor or benches were placed there, because that's not the point of the story*.
You can throw as many temper tantrums as you want, but in the end, it really doesn't actually make a difference whether it was explained or not; because the continued plot and setting (and gameplay, overall) needs these elements to exist. The why simply isn't important.
*There is a story specific prosecutor, and how important they are to the story remains to be seen, however the aspect here is prosecutors in general, not this one specifically. However, one simply needs to turn their thinking around. It's less "the prosecutor exists" and more "the defence does not", thus giving a reason for Phoenix to barge in. Why, as before, does not actually matter, because that's not what's important.
Last edited by whoknowscran on Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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CatMuto wrote:
So it's just like Japanifornia's court system.
How!? It really sounds like everyone gathers, says, "(Person) is said to have committed (crime), what say you, O'Great Mirror Of Decisions?" and then stares at the mirror, until it inadvertedly says 'Guitly' (because nobody in these game is ever declared Not Guilty until we save the day) and then everyone goes home, except the defendant who gets the death penalty or what-not.
Why?! Does the mirror actually care about evidence? It's a freaking mirror (whether sentient or sapient or nothing is not fully clear), they don't care about whatever flimsy evidence was brought up.
C-A
How!? It really sounds like everyone gathers, says, "(Person) is said to have committed (crime), what say you, O'Great Mirror Of Decisions?" and then stares at the mirror, until it inadvertedly says 'Guitly' (because nobody in these game is ever declared Not Guilty until we save the day) and then everyone goes home, except the defendant who gets the death penalty or what-not.
Why?! Does the mirror actually care about evidence? It's a freaking mirror (whether sentient or sapient or nothing is not fully clear), they don't care about whatever flimsy evidence was brought up.
C-A
*Gameplay segment and translation spoilers*
The mirror channel's the victim's last moments, it doesn't tell us whether a person is guilty or not.
Because, and I'm almost positive cases like this will appear in the game, the victim doesn't always know who killed them. Admittedly, in this case Payne is just a bully, but if the victim hadn't seen Bokuto doing whatever he was doing, they'd need a detective and prosecutor to build the case.
Not defence attorney's though. Those are trash and scum just because. Even the defendant seemed to have something against defence attorney's, from the translation Rubia made. This country really hates them on a really different level from Japan.
Presumably, when the whole mirror thing started they figured out how many guilty people were let free because of the dastardly attorney's and they gained public disdain and eventually fell out of fashion because they aren't paid enough for this.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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CatMuto wrote:
How!? It really sounds like everyone gathers, says, "(Person) is said to have committed (crime), what say you, O'Great Mirror Of Decisions?" and then stares at the mirror, until it inadvertedly says 'Guitly' (because nobody in these game is ever declared Not Guilty until we save the day) and then everyone goes home, except the defendant who gets the death penalty or what-not.
You'll need to have someone investigating and arresting a suspect and having a (somewhat strong) case against said suspect before it gets brought to court. You can't just bring anyone to court and accuse them of murder nilly-willy.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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SuperAj3 wrote:
I hope it's not like Cat said in it being the all powerful mirror that means no evidence is needed.
Ha.
SuperAj3 wrote:
Although, I kinda think that's how they'll treat it, and it'll be like PLvsAA where Nick needs to use the mirror to his advantage. That's OK, but I'd like them to not be blinded by the mirror and Leifa's presence.
It's already a given that everybody can see the mirror. They are effectively using it as infallible testimony, seeing as they can (apparently) see exactly what the victim last saw. From the power of deduction, this thus far can be established:
- Evidence still exists, as the option to present such during testimony still exists, even during this demo case. It's worth noting that presenting things is necessary during the demo (judging from reports), it just wasn't shown in the live stream.
- Phoenix jumped in spur of the moment. He wouldn't be able to present anything if the prosecution hadn't already.
- You don't seem to need to present contradictory evidence for mirror segments, just finding contradictions with them (likely comparing it to the court-record or dialogue).
Noting the above three as facts, it seems likely that whatever the prosecutor will be doing, they wouldn't be doing much of anything if Phoenix & Co. are the only ones with all the evidence. Basically, expect some autopsy reports to be updated. Well, the equivalent of such.
Last edited by whoknowscran on Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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whoknowscran wrote:
Basically, expect some autopsy reports to be updated. Well, the equivalent of such.
*sigh* As long as it doesn't result in the autopsy reports being wrong from the get-go. *cough 1-5 cough*
C-A
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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As for the mysterious new(?) prosecutor, I think it'll be someone completely new, not a returning character. Like all of you seem to be, I'm a bit more interested in why the prosecutor is there as opposed to who it is (at least for now).
On a final note, the one thing I REALLY want for this game is the return of the thought route, although maybe with some penalties added in. This was one of my favourite features from Dual Destinies, shallow though it was, it was also really cool. I think it's safe to say this game has me really intrigued.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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However, Rubia said that people in this game don't trust DAs. That made me think, why?
Do we know about anything related to both DAs and Kurain? Well, we do. We do about a trial that made people mock on Kurain, and a certain Defense Attorney who forced the Master to run away. Maybe the people there don't trust Defense Attorney because of the DL6? I think that could be a good explanation, and even though I don't want to get my hopes up, even that would point to Maya being in the game - probably.
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Quote:
(basically, I wanted a super long final case where you worked as all three attorneys to take down a country-hopping murderer...!)
No. Please, no. GK-5's case has proven that a Filibuster final case is boring and infuriating as fuck. I don't want super long cases. The idea of interlinking cases in general is pretty cool, especially with hopping the defense attorneys* but overall, no.
* Though the defense attorney stuff makes no sense, since they all play exactly the same, only with a different coat of paint.
C-A
PS: Personally, I don't care who the prosecutor is...
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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SuperAj3 wrote:
I wonder just how credible the mirror is. I hope it's not like Cat said in it being the all powerful mirror that means no evidence is needed. Although, I kinda think that's how they'll treat it, and it'll be like PLvsAA where Nick needs to use the mirror to his advantage. That's OK, but I'd like them to not be blinded by the mirror and Leifa's presence.
I think in the beginning everyone will be like ''the mirror has spoken''. But I guess murderers would know how the mirror works and would try to take advantage of this. After all, the victim was a person and can be fooled too. In the spur of the moment the victim could've thought they saw something, but in the end the victim was only fooled by the murderer.
But we know how AA works, and the judge and Leifa will be with ''the mirror has spoken'' stuff during the entire game even though you've proven that it can be wrong in past trials xDD
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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CatMuto wrote:
Quote:
(basically, I wanted a super long final case where you worked as all three attorneys to take down a country-hopping murderer...!)
No. Please, no. GK-5's case has proven that a Filibuster final case is boring and infuriating as fuck. I don't want super long cases. The idea of interlinking cases in general is pretty cool, especially with hopping the defense attorneys* but overall, no.
* Though the defense attorney stuff makes no sense, since they all play exactly the same, only with a different coat of paint.
C-A
PS: Personally, I don't care who the prosecutor is...
GK-5 was only really boring because after pretty much solving it all, they decided to make Old Man Jenkins be the big bad/final boss. (And an annoying one. Lol Diplomatic Immunity lol.) Though, it's one thing having a couple of dues ex machinas happen. We've come to expect them. But when a random, unnamed dude pulls one, that's when we need to sit down and just admit things have gone too far. GK-5 was just long and boring for the sake of it.
You CAN make cases longer than usual without being boring. GK-5 is a bad example of a long case
Agree that I don't really care who the prosecutor is, sorta. It'd be interesting if it was a monk, though. And we've been getting weirder as the series went on, honestly (talking about main rival, not final case prosecutors, I mean).
AA1 - Normal enough guy
AA2 - Lady with whip
AA3 - Coffee drinkin' guy with mask
AA4 - Rockstar
AA5 - Prisoner who acts like a samurai
Wouldn't be too far a stretch, honestly.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Professor Yoshi wrote:
CatMuto wrote:
Quote:
(basically, I wanted a super long final case where you worked as all three attorneys to take down a country-hopping murderer...!)
No. Please, no. GK-5's case has proven that a Filibuster final case is boring and infuriating as fuck. I don't want super long cases. The idea of interlinking cases in general is pretty cool, especially with hopping the defense attorneys* but overall, no.
* Though the defense attorney stuff makes no sense, since they all play exactly the same, only with a different coat of paint.
C-A
GK-5 was only really boring because after pretty much solving it all, they decided to make Old Man Jenkins be the big bad/final boss. (And an annoying one. Lol Diplomatic Immunity lol.) Though, it's one thing having a couple of dues ex machinas happen. We've come to expect them. But when a random, unnamed dude pulls one, that's when we need to sit down and just admit things have gone too far. GK-5 was just long and boring for the sake of it.
You CAN make cases longer than usual without being boring. GK-5 is a bad example of a long case
OK, so just to clarify, I wasn't thinking of something like GK-5, which was long, boring and drawn out. Instead I was thinking more of a sort of 'three cases in one', where the murderer was the same, but taking advantage of each country's legal system, or something like that...
I just think that switching between different attorneys DD style isn't great, as Apollo and Athena didn't really get their time in the lead defense spotlight, so a case where you get to play as all three might lead to some more quality character development time for the three of them (and would require a 'super' long case).
Hope that clarifies things.
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Quote:
You CAN make cases longer than usual without being boring. GK-5 is a bad example of a long case
Fine. 1-5, also a too long case, which made it boring. 2-4, same thing. 3-5 ALSO boring because it took too long for everyone to catch up to my brain.
C-A
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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Aster Selene wrote:
A friend pointed out that Gaspen's probably in this country so he can have an actual win record. That is, the only way he can have one is in a country with no defense attorneys on the bench...
Huh, that does make sense.
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Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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luck wrote:
I've just thought that if every game from now on is settled in a different country, Gaspen will show up in every one of them only to be defeated by Phoenix again and again, like some kind of curse.
Maybe it's me, but I'd find it funnier if each country had their own 'version' of Payne. Every country has their Ouchie, their Tzung (from German Verletzung - injury), their Doleur (French), etc, who suspiciously LOOK like the 'original' Payne, but are in no way related.
C-A
Re: Ace Attorney 6 live stage show at TGS - Apollo, demo foo
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I was a big fan of how Prosecutor Flynch in PLvPWAA was totally that games version of Payne, but it wasn't actually a Payne, just an different take on it.
This is the Dark Age of the Ace Attorney
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