Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
raging klavier crush
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Mikker wrote:
... I never did get that part. 
Saw it mostly as a half-hearted attempt at making her seem more human. Of course, having played GS3 before JFA, I see that she hasn't had any development at all, and the entire scene is not a sign of development as much as her not being herself. 
I don't even count that scene as part of Franziska. Franziska consist only of: Whipping in court, whipping outside of court, calling Phoenix fool, making up evidence, whipping police force, making deals with witnesses, then whipping them, and calling the detective Scruffy. And whip him once more.
Saw it mostly as a half-hearted attempt at making her seem more human. Of course, having played GS3 before JFA, I see that she hasn't had any development at all, and the entire scene is not a sign of development as much as her not being herself. I don't even count that scene as part of Franziska. Franziska consist only of: Whipping in court, whipping outside of court, calling Phoenix fool, making up evidence, whipping police force, making deals with witnesses, then whipping them, and calling the detective Scruffy. And whip him once more.Ahahaha. Well, of course you wouldn't be very sympathetic to Franziska then, if one of the scenes critical to the sympathetic side to her character somehow doesn't "count"!
But it's a build on the revelation in 2-3 that she really doesn't care about revenge for her father; she's been lashing out at Phoenix the whole time because of her love of Edgeworth. And it makes sense that there's a side to her that she'd be able to show to him, and only him. (Which is why you only see it the one time, and why it doesn't seem like "herself".) I don't think Franziska would ever let herself break down crying in front of anyone besides Miles.
In GS3, she's still immature, but she's continuing on and not giving up on being a prosecutor and proving herself. She doesn't completely "get it", yet, but she's found reasons to keep going that don't revolve around her family creed of perfection. That motivation was deconstructed and destroyed in JfA, and remember that she was ready to completely give up until the airport scene with Edgeworth, where he threatened to walk away. So the fact that she's still going in GS3 IS arguably a sign of development. It depends on how you look at it, I suppose--Fran is certainly a work in progress either way.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Struck by a blunt objection
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- The 'I'm gonna get revenge because of edgeworth'
- The 'I cry because I don't want Edgeworth to leave'
- The 'I was gonna give up if Edgeworth didn't stop me'
- The 'I wouldn't break down in front of anyone else than Edgeworth'
Those were probably the core things I completely missed
And without those, Franziska is basicly a cold blooded bitch with a whip.(I guess that is the curse of having to play the game without half the dialogue (edited out text, unreadable text on background with textbox removed)... because you need the sprites...)
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic toward
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Godot (BARELY) > Edgy>Franziska>Manny>Payne.
Manny definately went through something to make him so bitter and perfection-obsessed. If there's ever a fiction, fan or otherwise, the order might change.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic toward
Floating entity
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He's always pushing himself so hard (with his work, and life in general), and had to go through so much suffering. But he didn't became evil, like Manfred. Going through so much and still being able to stay true to your principles.. that's just something I really respect him for.
But then again, I haven't played GS 3 yet.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Science: It's cuter than ever
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*spoilers lololol*
Edgeworth was raised by Manfred the same way Franzy was, but the difference is that before that he'd already been influence by Gregory (who we can only assume is a very moral, very kind, man who is a great role model) and also by Phoenix to some extent, so once he'd lost the ambition to be perfect he still had something to fall back on and he could still grow and move forward.
Franziska, on the other hand, was entirely influenced by Manfred. From the moment of her birth (well...I'm assuming so, anyway) it's been drilled into her head to be perfect and win by any means necessary. Once she loses that perfection, she very clearly sees no point in even living anymore ("A prosecutor who shames themself with defeat should crawl into a hole and die!") and I think the fact that she managed to move on and continue prosecuting in GS3 is actually a huge effort and very admirable. It's not a surprise that she doesn't suddenly "realize the error of her ways" the same way Edgeworth does, because she hasn't known anything else and she doesn't have anybody around her to rely on or that needs her
As for the matter of her loving Edgeworth, that's kind of not deniable (When I say "loving" I mean in a general sense, not a romantic sense). Her father that was the absolute role model of everything she had been trying to achieve in her life was...um, they never actually stated it but I'm assuming he's dead...and she didn't seem to care at all in favor of chasing Edgeworth halfway across the world. Once she's lost and everything she's done in her life is meaningless, the one thing she lives for is seeing him again...I think she needed to feel like she was important to somebody, like her life had some sort of purpose, and then when she finally found him he threw a couple snarky comments in her face and made it perfectly clear that he didn't need her and he was far, far greater than her. The fact that she can be cold enough to not care how much she hurts people, to not care if her father's dead, to seemingly not care about anything at all and then suddenly break down crying in a public place because Edgeworth says he's "leaving" her? It's obvious she cares about him extremely, and he doesn't seem to care about her a bit. Therefore, I feel sorry for her.
....
OH MY GOD I AM SO SORRY FOR LIKE, WRITING A NOVEL YOU GUYS O.O;;;
ANYWAY, ACTUALLY ON TOPIC:
Franziska=orslightly>Edgeworth>Lana>...Godot?*hasn'tplayedgs3*
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
raging klavier crush
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SilverZephyr wrote:
The fact that she can be cold enough to not care how much she hurts people, to not care if her father's dead, to seemingly not care about anything at all and then suddenly break down crying in a public place because Edgeworth says he's "leaving" her? It's obvious she cares about him extremely, and he doesn't seem to care about her a bit. Therefore, I feel sorry for her.
I really enjoyed your post! Your view of Franziska, I think, mirrors how I see her and why I do sympathize with her.
I'd have to take issue a bit here, though. I thought it was pretty clear that Edgeworth loved her dearly, too--see how he acts when he bursts into the hospital asking for her; Franziska's description of him grabbing her and rushing to the hospital, the fact that he went after her to the airport at all--the thing is, he knows Franziska better than anyone. She's his family. So when she's being immature and bratty and asking him how dare he show his face in front of her, he knows she's lashing out and reacts accordingly--with dispassionate, disarming calm. Quintessential older, more mature sibling, who can see right through her.
Edgeworth was harsh and uncompromising with her in the airport, but it was a "tough love" kind of deal--because he wasn't casting her aside, being cold to declare he didn't need her anymore and throwing her love back in her face. He was trying to encourage her to grow up and stop her from spiralling down a self-destructive path (she had thrown away everything and was completely giving up)--telling her he did believe in her, that she could start again. But Franziska is Franziska, and all the rhetoric in the world couldn't get through to her--as you said, she spent her whole life under Manfred's tutelage. But the thought of Miles really parting ways with her finally made her willing to fight again, and I actually think that's more to Miles's credit than anything. Franziska had, after all, more or less been planning to "crawl into a hole and die" until he intervened.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Just for you Baki. can you marry me now?
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Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
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I think it's because Lana is the most selfless prosecutor in the game. She cares about someone else far more than she cares about herself and that basically altruistic aspect of herself is maliciously abused.
"Humanity is measured by the soul, not the flesh." ~~ Layla
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Holding the Mega Drive controller!
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CantFaketheFunk wrote:
Edgeworth, but Franziska a close second.
wibble :(
wibble :(
Is it wrong that I LOL at that?
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
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As one judge said to another, "Be just, but if you can't be just, be arbitrary."
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
5 cups a day keep the doctor away
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RadioShadow wrote:
CantFaketheFunk wrote:
Edgeworth, but Franziska a close second.
wibble :(
wibble :(
Is it wrong that I LOL at that?
...that edgeworth!! D:<
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Science: It's cuter than ever
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Raelle wrote:
SilverZephyr wrote:
The fact that she can be cold enough to not care how much she hurts people, to not care if her father's dead, to seemingly not care about anything at all and then suddenly break down crying in a public place because Edgeworth says he's "leaving" her? It's obvious she cares about him extremely, and he doesn't seem to care about her a bit. Therefore, I feel sorry for her.
I really enjoyed your post! Your view of Franziska, I think, mirrors how I see her and why I do sympathize with her.
I'd have to take issue a bit here, though. I thought it was pretty clear that Edgeworth loved her dearly, too--see how he acts when he bursts into the hospital asking for her; Franziska's description of him grabbing her and rushing to the hospital, the fact that he went after her to the airport at all--the thing is, he knows Franziska better than anyone. She's his family. So when she's being immature and bratty and asking him how dare he show his face in front of her, he knows she's lashing out and reacts accordingly--with dispassionate, disarming calm. Quintessential older, more mature sibling, who can see right through her.
Edgeworth was harsh and uncompromising with her in the airport, but it was a "tough love" kind of deal--because he wasn't casting her aside, being cold to declare he didn't need her anymore and throwing her love back in her face. He was trying to encourage her to grow up and stop her from spiralling down a self-destructive path (she had thrown away everything and was completely giving up)--telling her he did believe in her, that she could start again. But Franziska is Franziska, and all the rhetoric in the world couldn't get through to her--as you said, she spent her whole life under Manfred's tutelage. But the thought of Miles really parting ways with her finally made her willing to fight again, and I actually think that's more to Miles's credit than anything. Franziska had, after all, more or less been planning to "crawl into a hole and die" until he intervened.
Ah, you are of course, perfectly right, and that's a wonderful description of their relationship <3 I was trying to see things from a sympathetic-with-Franziska point of view, not an anti-Edgeworth point of view...like, just how she minght have seen things ^^; I think I kinda misworded it though and made him sound cold.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
raging klavier crush
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SilverZephyr wrote:
Ah, you are of course, perfectly right, and that's a wonderful description of their relationship <3 I was trying to see things from a sympathetic-with-Franziska point of view, not an anti-Edgeworth point of view...like, just how she minght have seen things ^^; I think I kinda misworded it though and made him sound cold.
No, no, I see what you mean. And you're probably right. The "tea party" comic Funk is fond of spamming gets me pretty hard, not because I think it's really an accurate reflection of the relationship--but I imagine it's often how Franziska does feel about it.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic toward
俺の黄金の魔女
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But, as for Franziska in GS3...
Spoiler: GS3
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic toward
Science: It's cuter than ever
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musouka wrote:
The prosecutor I feel most sympathetic towards is Edgeworth, but the prosecutor I pity the most is Godot.
But, as for Franziska in GS3...
But, as for Franziska in GS3...
Spoiler: GS3
*SPOILERS?*
I haven't played GS3, but from what you've described I COMPLETELY agree with you. I never expected Franzy to stop whipping people or stop wanting to win, but acting fairly in court, saying she's not doing it for herself? That sounds like HUGE development to me, especially since, like I said before, I really admire her for having the strength to continue at ALL, all things considered.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
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Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!
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VV
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Hug an Edgeworth today <3
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Thank you very much Deefunx for the sig ^_^
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
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AnorexicRainbows wrote:
Without a doubt, Edgeworth. Having to live with the idea of killing your father is pretty rough.
I agree, and having to hear...
Spoiler: Case 1-4
and have to go through the whole thing each night.
I also feel for Payne.
He must have been good before he...
Spoiler: Minor GS3 Spoilers
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Idol of Polar Bears
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There was also the fact that Edgeworth thought he truly was guilty for the murder of his father only to find out 15 years later that the true killer was none other than the man who mentored and shaped him up to be.
He shows amazing character development by 2-4, finally breaking away from the shadow of the Karmas and finding his true self, who he is, and what it means to be a lawyer. He also has some of the best quotes in the game: "As great a tragedy as it is to know the truth, it would be an even greater tragedy to avert one's eyes from it." (Which is basically saying, "I'm going to disregard the fact that this could be a pile of lies") and the speech he gave Wright during 2-4 ("Don't make me laugh Wright. You want "save people"? Hah!" "We claw and scratch for every inch we can get. No matter how much we try to cover things up, no matter how desperate the situation, no matter how concrete the evidence, in the end the truth will always find a way to reveal itself" or something along those lines).
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic toward
ROCK AND ROLL! HIGH SPEED!
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For me, it's
> 
> > 
(but that may change once GS3 comes out)> 
> 
> 
(only because I never played GS4, so I don't know him that well.)
My art thread!
My sprite thread! Calando in progress
Phoenix Wright and co.:Ace Mythbusters! Myth 2 finished
First AA fanfic: Childhood Turnabout (finished)
And my devart site
My billboard signature! *gets pelted with tomatoes*
My sprite thread! Calando in progress
Phoenix Wright and co.:Ace Mythbusters! Myth 2 finished
First AA fanfic: Childhood Turnabout (finished)
And my devart site
My billboard signature! *gets pelted with tomatoes*
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
The foxy ladies can't resist my sandwich
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mostly forSpoiler:
fuck
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
A passionate fart, smelling dead
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If only because he looks like an X-Men reject.
Mirror, mirror on the wall, show me, define me! I am the infinite telomerase! I am not an anti-existence! I AM THE PERFECT MISSINGNO.--er, chain!
Proud to be anti-Edgeworth!
Proud to be anti-Edgeworth!
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Comfy and easy to wear.
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About Manfred, though...
Spoiler:
And Miles.
Spoiler:
Haven't played GS3 and don't know much about it, to be honest. I'm trying to avoid spoilers like the plague.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Double-Edged Sword
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Spoiler:
comes in second, then , Neil Marshall, and . I have absolutely NO sympathy for .I know nothing of
or , as I'm avoiding anything and everything to do with GS3 and 4 until they come Stateside.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Animator who plays PW and watches ZIM :D
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Phoenix is totally Jewish.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
nuuuuu, stoooooop
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Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Idol of Polar Bears
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Insert obligatory "It's good to look at things in a different perspective." line here.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
US!
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or Spoiler:
Matt DeMasque!
*Currently playing Spirit of Justice*
*Currently playing Spirit of Justice*
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!
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as a prosector, having never faced her in court and all.
Re: Which Prosecutor do you feel the most sympathetic towards?
Live life to the full
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Lana has been blackmailed for two years, so she does deserve a lot of sympathy as well.
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