Re: Persona
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Pierre wrote:
Eh I thought more of Oracle from Persona 3. Actually surprised they'd be so lazy as to directly reuse a name from the same franchise, I feel Navi would have been better or even if they'd just kept her hacker codename.
Oh, right. That person.
...
I have no idea who you're referring to.
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sumguy28 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Eh I thought more of Oracle from Persona 3. Actually surprised they'd be so lazy as to directly reuse a name from the same franchise, I feel Navi would have been better or even if they'd just kept her hacker codename.
Oh, right. That person.
...
I have no idea who you're referring to.
Ugh maybe I'm mixing it up but didn't Fuuka use Oracle?
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Re: Persona
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Pierre wrote:
sumguy28 wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Eh I thought more of Oracle from Persona 3. Actually surprised they'd be so lazy as to directly reuse a name from the same franchise, I feel Navi would have been better or even if they'd just kept her hacker codename.
Oh, right. That person.
...
I have no idea who you're referring to.
Ugh maybe I'm mixing it up but didn't Fuuka use Oracle?
I had to look it up. Oracle is an ability that Fuuka gets upon Lucia changing to Hera that randomly grants a random buff.
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A few hours later, I did another attempt to defeat Madarame's Shadow again. I have to say, that attempt was VERY nice to me. When electricity was used, it usually hit Skull - who already resists it - and was generally dodging wind attacks. And single-target wind attacks went onto Mona, who resist those. Much kinder to me than any previous attempt, where Skull either didn't dodge or the AI tended to hit Mona with electricity. Or overall killed a party member, when I didn't have any Revival Beads. (By the way, I have altered the difficulty back to Normal. I can do Hard on an NG+, maybe. We'll see.)
At least I'm getting Makoto next... and then Futaba~
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Yes, Mona. I know. Yes, it is a steep price. Shut up. I know that I am not going to get all the confidants up to maximum; especially if even TAKEMI wants me to be at Level 4 Charisma to go past Level 7! At least I unlocked Iwai, okay? I've got lost of confidants open, I've got some of them at good levels and some will be maxed, but I am gonna focus more on getting all my social parameters to maximum for next time, okay?
Even if I feel a bit bad to ignore Chihaya, who is voiced by Matsuki...
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Re: Persona
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They are all on about making it obvious that something big happened with Okumura, so you go in and expect an awesome palace. And battle, and then you get this. Geez. Whatever, I just want to get Futaba to romance already.
I need to unlock ALL the locations for a Trophy? I'm guessing those AREN'T carried over in New Game Plus? Meaning, I would have to date ALL the women available? Urgh!
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Quote:
I need to unlock ALL the locations for a Trophy? I'm guessing those AREN'T carried over in New Game Plus? Meaning, I would have to date ALL the women available? Urgh!
Depends on your definition of "date." If you mean just agreeing to go to a spot when a confidant calls, then yes, there's at least one location that's only unlocked through that method, the others being part of confidant routes. If you mean getting into a relationship with everyone, then no. I got that trophy on a first playthrough without maxing every confidant and only romancing Makoto.
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Spoiler: Casino Palace
Also, I feel like I'm taking more damage in this palace. Either my personae/level isn't that good (49 for Joker), my equipment needs to improve more, or enemies seem to just hit harder now.
Gawd, I just want the Futaba Talk trophy and then I can throw Crow outta my party.
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Also don't throw away your sanity over the getting every trophy on a first run, especially the Futaba talk trophy. You'll need to do a NG+ anyway for the platinum trophy just to be at a decent enough level for the bonus boss.
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Re: Persona
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sumguy28 wrote:
A lot of hangout spots have multiple methods of unlocking them. Here's the complete list. And my mistake, you can but you don't need to accept an invitation over the phone to unlock certain spots.
Also don't throw away your sanity over the getting every trophy on a first run, especially the Futaba talk trophy. You'll need to do a NG+ anyway for the platinum trophy just to be at a decent enough level for the bonus boss.
Also don't throw away your sanity over the getting every trophy on a first run, especially the Futaba talk trophy. You'll need to do a NG+ anyway for the platinum trophy just to be at a decent enough level for the bonus boss.
Heck, I'm tempted to get as many trophies as possible, then do a completely new run. I already got the trophy for playing all the games, maxing parameters, etc. By the way, would the game please STOP having that dumb thing pop up when I gain points in something? I'm maxed out! No need to keep showing me that. I don't remember if P3 or P4 had this issue...
I did get to romance Futaba. The loading screen showing Joker with pink hearts floating about when you have the Rank 10 romantic event (or the.... spending some alone time... event) had me in stitches. I don't know why, I just think it looks funny. Funnier than when he wears a lei during Hawaii.
I love the game and several of its aspects, but by god, the plot falls apart so BADLY at the end.
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It’s a bit early to know for sure, but it might honestly be my favorite game I’ve ever played, with basically no competition whatsoever. I’ll go more in-depth on what I think of the confidants and palaces later on, but honestly there’s nothing I dislike about this game. At all.
I’ve got a big backlog of games to play still, but I’m hyped AF to play the other Persona games.
Last edited by Thunder84 on Mon May 07, 2018 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Still glad to see you liked it definitely one of my favourites from last year.
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Battle
- The battle system was a lot less complex than I thought it'd be, and that's a good thing. It's a simple game of exploiting the enemy weakness while also being engaging. I was frustrated every now and then when I got hit with an ailment I couldn't get rid of, but that's nitpicky at best.
- Mostly ran a Joker/Skull/Queen/Noir party, although I swapped Noir out for Crow and Panther near the end.
- I didn't fuse personas as much as I thought I would. I was able to mostly keep up-to-date on personas of my level, so it was never really an issue. Also, with Queen covering Nuclear and Noir covering Psi the only element I struggled to find was Bless/Curse.
- Played on easy mode, as I always do with major RPGs. I play these for the experience, not the difficulty. Maybe I'll play it on a harder mode this time through.
Palaces
- Didn't expect these at all. Loved the variety in them, and the bosses (for the most part) too.
Spoiler: Quick Palace Ranking
Life Gameplay
- This is where the game really shines for me. The schedule management is a lot more important than I realized, and before I knew it I had wasted away half my time at Big Bang Burger.
- Upgrading the social stats is a bit annoying, but I like how it forces you to prioritize certain confidants. I didn't realize this until too late, so my desperate attempts to raise my charm to go out with Makoto were for naught. Luckily, NG+ is a thing.
- The confidant paths themselves are pretty cool, although some were kinda boring at times (Ann, Ohya, etc). Missed four on my first run: The fortune teller, The politician, The gamer, and...Haru? I actually never established a confidant connection with Haru, which surprised me. I guess I missed something.
- I had no idea romancing was an option, and it actually played out in-game as I obliviously turned down 3 girls. I said to Ann "You have the others" because I didn't want to be self-centered, and Kawakami/Takemi was just...no. They're great, but no. Not romancing was the best option for the first run though, as I was able to see some really fucking hilarious scenes. Ryuji on Valentines day was great, but the Hawaii stuff takes the cake. Seeing Ryuji and Mishima helplessly try to attact girls, get chased by a pair of gropy gay guys, and then have Yusuke walk back with two fucking live lobsters had me laughing my ass off. Good stuff. Speaking of which...
Writing
- Holy hell, the writing in this game is superb. It's not often you get a game that can convey both incredibly deep topics and humor at the same time.
- It gets a bit sketchy near the 5th palace, what with Morgana suddenly developing an inferiority complex and Ryuji suddenly being a complete fucking moron. It picks right back up though.
Presentation
- God, I love the artstyle so much. I dunno what the genre is, but I want more of it.
- The music is fantastic. There aren't any huge standout songs besides "Life Will Change" for me, but they're all good or great.
- Voice acting is also superb. There were a few that weren't that great, but overall it was conveyed very well.
Story
- I'll get into it more in spoilers, but god damn was the story engaging. The only hiccup was the portion before the 5th palace, but other than that I loved it.
Spoiler: Story Spoilers
For my next run-through, I'm thinking of purchasing the Persona 3/4 DLC. I haven't played either, but I love the P4 costume set and the P3 battle theme.
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I still haven't gotten to the final section of the game. I am two days away from getting to the "This is the big decision; will you answer in ways to get a Bad Ending or continue onto the True Ending path?" part, but I just lost interest. The casino was cool, don't get me wrong. Just... once again, I feel it went on a little too long. Guess that's a good way to explain my feelings for most of the Palaces. Cool concept, cool ideas and designs, cool puzzles, but they drag a bit.
At least it isn't AS bad as Persona 4 with the "I dunno, you gotta tell me abot the person before I can locate them..." taking a few days.
Cool that you noticed that big twist. Out of curiosity, what made you say it? Especially as someone with no previous Persona experience.
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CatMuto wrote:
Algebra? Never saw it like that. I recall that Palace because I got stuck by overlooking the obvious path when I first got to the giant room at the bottom. I have to say about the Space Station Palace... it was cool! Well, at first... the novelty of it wore down near the end; I didn't mind the airlocks, especially since they were easy to figure out, but I feel like the Palace went on a little too long.
I still haven't gotten to the final section of the game. I am two days away from getting to the "This is the big decision; will you answer in ways to get a Bad Ending or continue onto the True Ending path?" part, but I just lost interest. The casino was cool, don't get me wrong. Just... once again, I feel it went on a little too long. Guess that's a good way to explain my feelings for most of the Palaces. Cool concept, cool ideas and designs, cool puzzles, but they drag a bit.
At least it isn't AS bad as Persona 4 with the "I dunno, you gotta tell me abot the person before I can locate them..." taking a few days.
Cool that you noticed that big twist. Out of curiosity, what made you say it? Especially as someone with no previous Persona experience.
I still haven't gotten to the final section of the game. I am two days away from getting to the "This is the big decision; will you answer in ways to get a Bad Ending or continue onto the True Ending path?" part, but I just lost interest. The casino was cool, don't get me wrong. Just... once again, I feel it went on a little too long. Guess that's a good way to explain my feelings for most of the Palaces. Cool concept, cool ideas and designs, cool puzzles, but they drag a bit.
At least it isn't AS bad as Persona 4 with the "I dunno, you gotta tell me abot the person before I can locate them..." taking a few days.
Cool that you noticed that big twist. Out of curiosity, what made you say it? Especially as someone with no previous Persona experience.
Spoiler: Big Twist
The palaces are much shorter on a 2nd run-through. Granted, that most likely comes from me absolutely tearing apart any shadow I see, but knowing where to go helps quite a bit. It also lets me spend a lot more time with confidants, which is nice.
Romanced Makoto (because duh) and her confidant path is pretty cute. It's gonna suck turning the other girls down now (Not looking towards turning Futaba and Haru down) but I want that Valentine's scene, dammit!
EDIT: Of fucking course, the first "date" I spend with Makoto she ends up telling me to go find a book for her while she talks with Hifumi. God dammit.
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Speaking of the confidants, they're all really good. I figured I might as well rank them while they're fresh on my mind. I didn't take the auto-advancing confidants (Igor, Akechi, Sae, Morgana) into account.
Spoiler: Confidants
Also, as I predicted before, turning down Haru is fucking painful. Not only is she the only confidant to be absolutely devastated when you turn them down, but the devs make it absolutely clear that she has a crush on you. Whether it's her saying "I've always longed for this" when you rescue her, or her literally calling you "her hero", they make you feel guilty as all hell. Granted, they do a lot of similar things with you and Makoto earlier on, but holy shit they're relentless with Haru.
And before anyone tries to kill me, I see Futaba as more of a little sister. She's fucking awesome, don't get me wrong. But I can't see her as a romantic option. I just can't.
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1. The setting is cool. I prefer P5 Tokyo so far though.
2. Dojima is pretty cool so far. I definitely see parallels between him and Sojiro.
3. Nanako is adorable. She's not on Pearls level yet, but she's getting there fast. Her singing the Junes theme was the highlight so far.
4. I love the cast so far. Yosuke seems like a more chill Ryuji, which is nice. Yukiko is also awesome, and when she said her whole "I've never had a boyfriend" thing I knew she would be my romance target. Chie annoyed me a bit at first, but I've already turned around on her.
5. My Ace Attorney/Layton senses are tingling, and I've already got a few early guesses on who the serial killer is.
Spoiler: Spoilers I guess
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1. While P5 tops P4G in gameplay, I find the character development better in P4G with all the extra scenes. The pick-up contest, the campout, etc are all really well written. I don't necessarily prefer the characters per se (I find both games about equal in that regard) but these extra scenes are fantastic.
2. The dungeons are rather disappointing, but the themes are incredible. I was worried after the first dungeon was another palace, but a bathhouse and a fucking strip club? I'd love to see this game remade in the P5 engine with actual dungeons.
3. Also, I love how awkward the shadows are. Surprised everything's been so sexual so far.
4. Nanako is officially the best thing to ever happen in a video game. Ever. Period.
5.
Spoiler: 4th dungeon
6.
Spoiler: Killer prediction
7. Teddie turning into a human was not something I expected at all. Wish he stayed like that in the TV World instead of his weird bear suit.
8. Romanced Yukiko already. Dunno why I like her so much, but she’s my favorite of both games so far.
EDIT:
Spoiler: Late game spoilers
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Spoiler: Ending
EDIT: Haha I'm dumb, I missed the good ending. Lucky me. Back to the grind I go.
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Also, I just found out that Teddie's VA in P4G is Sam Riegel, who is also Phoenix's VA in the newer games. I don't think I'll ever see Phoenix the same way again.
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1. Good god Tartarus sucks. I was willing to give it the benefit of the doubt, but not only is it incredibly boring but the grind is awful. The EXP is horribly balanced, and I always was underleveled despite numerous nights of grinding. Blech.
2. The bosses were also pretty mediocre. Persona has never really had that great of bosses, but at least the ones in 4/5 were unique. These...aren't (Barring the Fortune boss and the final boss).
3. The social links definitely feel the most rushed out of all 3 games. There's some real stinkers in there (Kenji and Nozumi are awful, while Hidetoshi, Keisuke, and Mutatsu are incredibly mediocre). Even the good ones (Chihiro, Maiko, Mamoru, Akinari come to mind) could've been much longer. Speaking of social links...
4. Why in god's name are the party members either not social link eligible or locked behind attributes? The guys go through some really good development (Especially Junpei and Akihiko) but you never really get to know them; all their development comes during scenes where you're viewing it as a third party rather than through the Protag. And while the girls social links are decent, having them locked so late-game just feels...weird. The entire first half of the game feels rather empty due to the fact that you don't really know anyone in your party.
5. Luckily, the story fucking skyrockets after a certain event that I'm sure many of you know
Spoiler: Mid-late game spoilers
6. The final boss was absolutely incredible. The music was fantastic, and the boss itself was the perfect difficulty for my level, with people dying every now and then but for the most part I was able to hold strong.
7. Now...the ending.
Spoiler: Ending spoilers
Not sure now if I'll play Persona 2 or not. I've heard the story is fantastic, but that the gameplay is awful.
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Thunder84 wrote:
3. The social links definitely feel the most rushed out of all 3 games. There's some real stinkers in there (Kenji and Nozumi are awful, while Hidetoshi, Keisuke, and Mutatsu are incredibly mediocre). Even the good ones (Chihiro, Maiko, Mamoru, Akinari come to mind) could've been much longer. Speaking of social links...
4. Why in god's name are the party members either not social link eligible or locked behind attributes? The guys go through some really good development (Especially Junpei and Akihiko) but you never really get to know them; all their development comes during scenes where you're viewing it as a third party rather than through the Protag. And while the girls social links are decent, having them locked so late-game just feels...weird. The entire first half of the game feels rather empty due to the fact that you don't really know anyone in your party.
4. Why in god's name are the party members either not social link eligible or locked behind attributes? The guys go through some really good development (Especially Junpei and Akihiko) but you never really get to know them; all their development comes during scenes where you're viewing it as a third party rather than through the Protag. And while the girls social links are decent, having them locked so late-game just feels...weird. The entire first half of the game feels rather empty due to the fact that you don't really know anyone in your party.
Aside from the unlocking requirements, these issues are fixed in the P3P-exclusive female protagonist route, where the author of many of the P4 social links (different author from P3) authored social links that weren't in the original game. The male party members are included in these new social links.
New Game+ in P3P lets you carry over a lot of things, including MC's level (even if you change protagonists), so you can readily breeze through the game if you want to see the female protagonist's social links for yourself.
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Spoiler:
(But really it's just another example of how Yukari is terrible and should never have been invited to the team)
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Quote:
Good god Tartarus sucks.
At least it's miles better than the god-awful narrow corridor mess that is the Persona 4 dungeons. The different Shadow AI doesn't help its case either. At least in P3, you have more space to maneuvre around the Shadows if you wanted to avoid fighting, and surprise attacks are actually feasible.
If you ask me, Persona 3 has the best gameplay in the series. Yes, I said it. If anything, P4 only trivialised many aspects that made the previous installment stand out. Honestly, IMO, the only improvement P4 brought gameplay-wise was the ability to friendzone female SLs (and maybe bringing back direct party member control, if that's your thing).
Quote:
(But really it's just another example of how Yukari is terrible and should never have been invited to the team)
Or rather an example that The Answer is chock full of bad writing and shouldn't have been a thing. The character rewrites Yukari and Mitsuru go through are abysmal, and the whole "conflict within the group" was so forced and contrived it was painful to go through.
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Quote:
(and maybe bringing back direct party member control, if that's your thing).
Direct party member control is what automatically makes me see 4 as an improvement over 3. I get that 3 was trying to make the other party members feel like other people, but all that did was make the other party members look like idiots.
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Also, Mitsuru usually spammed Tentarafoo more that Marin Karin on Act Freely for me, so I guess I missed out on the meme.
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In Persona 3, each party member has a basic attack, up to eight skills, and several dozen items.. There's just not enough AI commands to get all the right moves you want. You can try to get Yukari to use Mediarama and heal the whole party to full, but instead she'll use Diarahan on the dog while the rest of you take a Megidola to the face.
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Fair enough, I suppose. Maybe I should replay P3FES sometime to see how the AI holds up again.
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SPInc wrote:
Quote:
Good god Tartarus sucks.
At least it's miles better than the god-awful narrow corridor mess that is the Persona 4 dungeons. The different Shadow AI doesn't help its case either. At least in P3, you have more space to maneuvre around the Shadows if you wanted to avoid fighting, and surprise attacks are actually feasible.
If you ask me, Persona 3 has the best gameplay in the series. Yes, I said it. If anything, P4 only trivialised many aspects that made the previous installment stand out. Honestly, IMO, the only improvement P4 brought gameplay-wise was the ability to friendzone female SLs (and maybe bringing back direct party member control, if that's your thing).
You mean how the shadows will attack you if you try to stab them too early? Or how they're practically unavoidable on corners? The camera controls of Tartarus were awful too. While the P4 dungeons weren't that exciting, I'd take them any day over the shitshow of Tartarus.
I was blessed that I was playing with P3P because I can't stand AI-controlled members either.
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Pierre wrote:
If you play Persona 3s "The Answer" you get to see more of how
affects the party.
(But really it's just another example of how Yukari is terrible and should never have been invited to the team)
Spoiler:
(But really it's just another example of how Yukari is terrible and should never have been invited to the team)
I heard that the Answer was a grindfest, so I just looked up a summary of it and watched some cutscenes. It looks alright, and while Yukari's reaction makes some sense Mitsuru's just seems incredibly unlike her. At least it looks like Junpei got some really good development.
Re: Persona
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Re: Persona
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Also the AI commands deserve a bad rep because early on you get a fight against three birds weak to bows that will kill Junpei with his weakness. You only have protag Junpei and Yukari but rather than knock them all down Yukari will target the same bird twice and Junpei will be destroyed.
AI commands can go to hell
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Re: Persona
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Thunder84 wrote:
You mean how the shadows will attack you if you try to stab them too early?
Not exactly. The way the Shadows' AI in P4 works is that they have a radius in which they can spot you, even if they don't actually see you, which makes jumping them quite challenging, especially with reduced mobility thanks to the narrow corridors.
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Or how they're practically unavoidable on corners?
Yes, yes, all the yes. Not just corners though - turning around in a straight hallway while trying to avoid combat is pure torture.
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The camera controls of Tartarus were awful too.
Is that so? I played both FES and Portable, and I found the camera to be fine (though I do think FES has less of a problem with that).
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Nah man P4s dungeons stomp Tartarus any day of the week. Making them unique to the character was a welcome change than just the endless generic tower.
No, that's not what I meant. Story-wise, yes, the dungeons in P4 are far superior for the aforementioned reasons (even though every floor being pratically the same with almost no variations other than a subtle colour change does feel lazy (yes, I do realise the same complaint can be applied to Tartarus as well), which is where P5 knocks both 3 and 4 out in every way imaginable). I meant that in terms of level design - the godforsaken narrow corridors coupled with obnoxious Shadow AI make exploring the TV world more of a hassle than necessary.
Re: Persona
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SPInc wrote:
Thunder84 wrote:
You mean how the shadows will attack you if you try to stab them too early?
Not exactly. The way the Shadows' AI in P4 works is that they have a radius in which they can spot you, even if they don't actually see you, which makes jumping them quite challenging, especially with reduced mobility thanks to the narrow corridors.
Nah, I was referring to the times in P3 where a shadow would be charging at me. Naturally, I'd try to stab them in order to avoid an Enemy Advantage. However, for whatever reason, it's incredibly finicky and I'd constantly stab too early, letting the shadow jump me anyway. I didn't have any trouble jumping shadows in either game.
SPInc wrote:
Thunder84 wrote:
Or how they're practically unavoidable on corners?
Yes, yes, all the yes. Not just corners though - turning around in a straight hallway while trying to avoid combat is pure torture.
Once again, I'm referring to P3. I had very little issue avoiding shadows in P4 unless I ran into a dead end. In P3? Those shadows have instincts of a fucking cheetah. I couldn't pass by any of them unless I was in an open room.
SPInc wrote:
Thunder84 wrote:
The camera controls of Tartarus were awful too.
Is that so? I played both FES and Portable, and I found the camera to be fine (though I do think FES has less of a problem with that).
The camera constantly needs to be changed in order to be behind you, which makes running away from shadows absolute torture. Either you press the button to switch the camera and slow down, letting the enemy behind you ambush you, or you run into a shadow in front of you because you can't see anything. It sucks.
Re: Persona
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You don't actually need to press the shoulder buttons to change the camera direction - just press circle to switch the camera to the direction the MC is facing - can be used on the go too. Fairly certain both P3FES and P4 have this as well (P3P definitely does, just checked). Or is this what you're referring to?
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