Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Akiak wrote:
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
Two words- Original Characters. It doesn't have to be all original cast. Nothing stopping it from having a heap of new characters in it :)
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Akiak wrote:
The fact about Hammond is that he is described as one of those lawyers that only care about winning, like the Karmas. The protagonist should usually always be someone seeking justice.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
That is why I suggested that there be two main characters: Diego, and Gregory. Diego would have the first "tutorial" case, mentored by Grossberg, while in the second case, the two could cooperate somehow. Then the third case would be the trial with Gregory alone against Manfred, where he gets Manfred penalized, even though he loses the trial.
Notice how we've used the two characters equally until now. The fourth case would take place after Gregory gets killed, and would have Diego as the attorney.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
That is why I suggested that there be two main characters: Diego, and Gregory. Diego would have the first "tutorial" case, mentored by Grossberg, while in the second case, the two could cooperate somehow. Then the third case would be the trial with Gregory alone against Manfred, where he gets Manfred penalized, even though he loses the trial.
Notice how we've used the two characters equally until now. The fourth case would take place after Gregory gets killed, and would have Diego as the attorney.
I dunno, I still amn't sure about the idea of Diego being the protagonist, and I do like the idea of the main character NOT being a 'good guy'. And as well as that, with two protagonists, it could get very jumpy, but that depends on how it's done. So I mean, it could work.
I like the idea of the tutorial case being Diego's case, though. If it was Hammond's first case, it would have to take place a good few years before you get to meet Diego or Mia, so the law offices would just be you and Grossberg. Exciting stuff. XD
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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I'm sure that there's alot that'd happen that they'd cover up from others. Maybe you play a detective that covers their tracks or somethign :)
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Quote:
The fact about Hammond is that he is described as one of those lawyers that only care about winning, like the Karmas. The protagonist should usually always be someone seeking justice.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
When was he described as this?
Sure he made Yanni insane effectively ruining his life, but hell the ghost of the deceased gave testimony against him even though Hammond managed to pick apart this testimony it looks like there's no other option. Hammond did the only possible option to save an innocent man. He probably even told him about the downsides to it since Yanni had to act the part. I'd like to think Hammond did everything he could to save Yanni.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Pierre wrote:
Quote:
The fact about Hammond is that he is described as one of those lawyers that only care about winning, like the Karmas. The protagonist should usually always be someone seeking justice.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
When was he described as this?
It was mentioned in 1-4 at some point, but I don't remember the exact quote. I think it was Edgeworth who said it, but I could be wrong. ...I probably wasn't very helpful...
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Hm, let me see. Maybe I can do something about him.
EDIT: http://filebox.me/download?filepath=files/q0b09g9jr_HammondVC.rar&filename=HammondVC.rar
Hammond voice clips. Made by me.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Pierre wrote:
Quote:
The fact about Hammond is that he is described as one of those lawyers that only care about winning, like the Karmas. The protagonist should usually always be someone seeking justice.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
Gregory, on the other hand is perfect for the main character role, but then there's another problem. He's very old, and there aren't many characters we know connected to him.
When was he described as this?
I believe it was Edgey. He said something along the lines of "Sure, he saved Yanni, but he only did it for himself. Yanni's life was ruined after his plea."
I agree that he did all the possible to try and get a Not Guilty verdict, but the reason is what's important.
It may sound cool to be evil for once, but the truth is that there will be many parts of the game where the player is actually disagreeing with Hammond's actions, which is why he should be a secondary character. Think about it, why do we play Ace Attorney? Not because we're lawyers that earn money from the game. We simply want to know the truth behind a case. An evil protagonist would bring up a lot of problems.
And Vitor, thanks for the clips. If this project is ever started, it'll help. They're nicely done.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Arkillian wrote:
That can also be heresay. Maybe Robert had a reason that wasn't totally wholesome. It doesn't make him canon an evil lawyer. It is rather dodgy though >:)
You're right, he doesn't look particularly evil to me, it don't mean he's evil by default for all we know that's just what most of the community thinks, since I'm guessing there are plenty who suspected Yanni wasn't insane at first. What Hammond did would seem evil to the law community but he could still do it for all the right reasons.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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@Pierre & Arkillian: This is tangential to what you guys said, but something that bugs me about the AA universe: in the US, most defense attorneys would do what Hammond did - get a not guilty without caring about the guilt of the defendant. It's one of the reasons that lawyers are considered sleazy here, but it's also the purpose of the defense/prosecution system and why all criminal defendants are required to have adequate counsel.
I don't really remember the justification for it, but I think the general sense is that it's more important to have a system that won't convict innocent people than one that won't let any guilty parties escape. At the very least, they don't want people serving more time than they deserve to serve. Hence, defense lawyers may argue as if all of their clients are innocent/guilty of lesser crimes, even the same clients are obviously guilty.
[TL;DR] Ultimately, my point is that in the real world, Hammond is hardly "evil." He's the only one in AA who actually seems to be a normal US defense attorney. Prosecutors are supposed to care about the truth and whether the defendant deserves jail, but not the defense.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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What most lawyers try for is the best verdict for their client. The truth in some form usually comes out, but they're paid to represent their client's best wishes- to not have big consequences. IF they don't believe in their client then they shouldn't take the job. It's unrealistic to compare Ace Attorney to real life. It's stylised realism.
That's my take anyways :p
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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But Hammond always struck me as an average lawyer rather than an exceptional one like Phoenix or Gregory. If anything DL-6 was his shining moment I think, probably in his eyes at least considering how the evidence was stacked against his client. I do expect Hammond has lost a few cases in his time. However I don't think that means he has to act like an evil lawyer by default.
Hm it's such a shame it may have been the only way to get Yanni off the hook yet years later he'd get killed by him for saving his life.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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I don't remember 1-4 perfectly, but was it even possible for Hammond to connect von Karma to the crime at the time? I thought it was the note that Yanni Yogi had in his shack that let you link VK to DL6, though I could be wrong. But it's possible that the most accurate verdict Hammond could have hoped for was what he got. :P
I always thought it was kind of silly how the game was like "temporary insanity verdict ruined YY's life." Great, he admitted that he shot someone under extreme physical circumstances where he went insane. He should totally be blamed for that, because, you know, he was insane and didn't make the choice himself
. That's why there's a temporary insanity verdict: so that people who aren't blameworthy because they're crazy don't get blamed. I could see negative repercussions for a temp insanity verdict if it looked staged or fake, and people thought it was just used to get the defendant free, but YY has an airtight (aha! aha! aha! aha! 
) reason to have been insane. On the flip side, I suppose it's possible that his life was ruined just because his fiancee(?) was just upset that he could kill anyone at all, even when he was crazy.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Still, for the sake of a game, I think it'd be far more interesting if he did turn out to be a nasty, selfish sort of person. It'd go back to what we were discussing in the last page, how Grossberg's law firm wasn't a very nice place.
And completely off topic and pointless, but...Akiak, I just noticed you joined CR on my birthday.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Lynx wrote:
I mostly agree with you, Arkillian, even if I didn't make that clear. My point was that Hammond isn't really evil - he's just normal. In the game, he doesn't seem to be a liar nor does he convince people to commit perjury. But one of the themes in the thread has been "Hammond is shady" even though, IMO, it doesn't seem that he is. Just because he laid back and accepted a not guilty for Yogi doesn't put him anywhere out of the pale. Like Pierre said, he's just not an exceptional lawyer who will try to get 100% of the truth and try to finger another culprit. He just does what he can to reduce the punishment.
I don't remember 1-4 perfectly, but was it even possible for Hammond to connect von Karma to the crime at the time? I thought it was the note that Yanni Yogi had in his shack that let you link VK to DL6, though I could be wrong. But it's possible that the most accurate verdict Hammond could have hoped for was what he got. :P
I always thought it was kind of silly how the game was like "temporary insanity verdict ruined YY's life." Great, he admitted that he shot someone under extreme physical circumstances where he went insane. He should totally be blamed for that, because, you know, he was insane and didn't make the choice himself. That's why there's a temporary insanity verdict: so that people who aren't blameworthy because they're crazy don't get blamed. I could see negative repercussions for a temp insanity verdict if it looked staged or fake, and people thought it was just used to get the defendant free, but YY has an airtight (aha! aha! aha! aha! ) reason to have been insane. On the flip side, I suppose it's possible that his life was ruined just because his fiancee(?) was just upset that he could kill anyone at all, even when he was crazy.
I don't remember 1-4 perfectly, but was it even possible for Hammond to connect von Karma to the crime at the time? I thought it was the note that Yanni Yogi had in his shack that let you link VK to DL6, though I could be wrong. But it's possible that the most accurate verdict Hammond could have hoped for was what he got. :P
I always thought it was kind of silly how the game was like "temporary insanity verdict ruined YY's life." Great, he admitted that he shot someone under extreme physical circumstances where he went insane. He should totally be blamed for that, because, you know, he was insane and didn't make the choice himself
. That's why there's a temporary insanity verdict: so that people who aren't blameworthy because they're crazy don't get blamed. I could see negative repercussions for a temp insanity verdict if it looked staged or fake, and people thought it was just used to get the defendant free, but YY has an airtight (aha! aha! aha! aha! ) reason to have been insane. On the flip side, I suppose it's possible that his life was ruined just because his fiancee(?) was just upset that he could kill anyone at all, even when he was crazy.I think the note in question was from Von Karma, which tied him to it all. His perfect revenge on Gregory was to not just kill him but to twist and destroy his son too with implicating him as his own fathers killer, a plan which he took so many years to bring to fulfillment.. Which is what makes him so damn devil like yet great, only someone as ego driven as Von Karma would take revenge so far.
I do actually wonder how Grossberg's Law Firm effected a young developing Diego then Mia, did they get into ethical conflicts or embrace in someway the tactics used. We never hear a thing about Hammond really or other possible lawyers at the office. I like film Noir myself, so a little underground sleaze, blurred edged morals and black on black sometimes gets my enthusiasm going more than constantly coming from a purely moral higher ground or complete trust stance. Though of course that would raise the audience age a bit, I was playing a game called Jake Hunter, I liked that actually though there are two versions, one has a funny side case game mode thing which is funny, if over the top and cute chibi style. I think something like that would be fun for Phoenix Wright,
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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I agree though- HE's more likely a realistic lawyer :) The one and only (or one of the few)
SerialVER wrote:
I think the note in question was from Von Karma, which tied him to it all. His perfect revenge on Gregory was to not just kill him but to twist and destroy his son too with implicating him as his own fathers killer, a plan which he took so many years to bring to fulfillment.. Which is what makes him so damn devil like yet great, only someone as ego driven as Von Karma would take revenge so far.
If this is true, that man is going to come back from the dead and haunt Phoenix for EVER like Dahlia did. SERIOUSLY. That is one big huge butt hurt right there if he wanted to destroy Gregory THAT badly! Or was it just convenient? ;)
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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P!ATD wrote:
And completely off topic and pointless, but...Akiak, I just noticed you joined CR on my birthday.
Consider my registration a birthday gift then.
Anyway, I agree with Ark that we don't know much about him, just that he's considered selfish by many.
But enough debating. Does anyone want to actually make this game?
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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also:
Arkillian wrote:
Ceres wrote:
Also, here's a little pic that shows Diego as a rookie attorney, Hammond and Grossberg are there as well. :p
http://www.court-records.net/arts/08043 ... snap02.jpg
http://www.court-records.net/arts/08043 ... snap02.jpg
Excuse me as I nose bleed from Diego in this...He's so f@#$ing HOT in this OMG YES.
Yeah- it's strange to see Grossberg younger, and to see them hanging out casually. I wonder if maybe the company was pretty close nit. I mean, Grossberg did have a sentimental side. He did care alot about those around him.
As a side note, I don't have ALOT of art with Robert Hammond in, but these pages in my comic 'Turnabout Attorney' has him in it
Spoiler:
He's also in this sketch I made:-
Spoiler:
i'm SO gonna read this comic when i get home from school!
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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I had to stop writing cause I got REALLY busy, and now I'm going back to writing it, I realize I need more plot device to finish it. XD I wonder if I should have some Diego day flash backs to get some Robert action in 
Heh. All of Turnabout will be posted on the net as it's made, but I think I have 1 or 2 copies of the comic itself left >.> I was talked into printing it. This is the gallery on my DA account dedicated to it anywaysActually- I've been approached for helping writing a game for this XD Not sure if they're interested in a big team, but if people are interested in helping out the story, then I'd atleast be keen to know! I've been thinking about how the story would go. It'd be interesting to steer away from the AA set up for it though.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Arkillian wrote:
Actually- I've been approached for helping writing a game for this XD Not sure if they're interested in a big team, but if people are interested in helping out the story, then I'd atleast be keen to know! I've been thinking about how the story would go. It'd be interesting to steer away from the AA set up for it though.
Wait, are you referring to a game about Turnabout Attorney? Or about this whole Grossberg Law offices in the past thing?
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Akiak wrote:
Wait, are you referring to a game about Turnabout Attorney? Or about this whole Grossberg Law offices in the past thing?
Grossberg law past thing. Although it could be in Ace Attorney format >.> Unlikely thoguh. It doesn't sound like it steers in that direction well...
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Arkillian wrote:
Akiak wrote:
Wait, are you referring to a game about Turnabout Attorney? Or about this whole Grossberg Law offices in the past thing?
Grossberg law past thing. Although it could be in Ace Attorney format >.> Unlikely thoguh. It doesn't sound like it steers in that direction well...
Oh so more of a fanfic or comic? I could probably help with the story in that case.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
I'd say
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Please, tell me more. XD
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Arkillian wrote:
None of the above ^^; It's intended on being a playable game...
Tis good news
Here was I thinking this was all just big talk but someone's actually planning on making it.
What would the case rundown be? Anything we know?
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Shall it follow a character like Diego?
Or shall it follow the office in general like a chronicle of past events?
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Arkillian wrote:
None of the above ^^; It's intended on being a playable game...
Your previous post confused me.
So yeah, that's even better. Since I was starting to plan it myself before, may I join in?
Also, what Perry said.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Speaking of DL-6, I've just thought of something. Manfred Von Karma was the person who thought of Yogi's plan to frame Edgeworth. Well, what if Manfred leaked infomation or sent a note to Robert Hammond saying there was lots of evidence against Yogi and that he should have Yogi plead insanity. I know Manfred can't stand defense attorneys, but he'd definenty do it to help him get away from murder. Then, to futher seal the deal, he leaks information to Redd White so he can blackmail Grossberg and discredit Misty Fey. I doubt Manfred knew about the Feys, but all the note would have to say is that the police used a spirit medium in DL-6 and lost and give Redd Grossberg's name and let White take care of the rest. I know Manfred could come up with something that diabotical. Though there's still the issue of how Manfred knew of Redd White.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Lynx wrote:
I don't remember 1-4 perfectly, but was it even possible for Hammond to connect von Karma to the crime at the time?
There was the bullet hole in the elevator door that would have pointed to the possibility of an outside shooter if Hammond had caught it. Once that was seen, it was simply a matter of who in the courthouse would have a reason to want to kill Gregory Edgeworth.
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Persian wrote:
Am I the only one to think that Robert Hammond look a lot like Severus Snape, from the "Harry Potter" movies?
I thought he looked like a typical noir laywer, but I see the resemblance XD I bet if the game gave him ANY personality, he'd be shipped in the same way as him XD (Wouldn't object)
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Discussions peoples! How low do you think Robert Hammond would go to get an innocent verdict?
Oh yes, and art- cause he's awesome :)
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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It is really sad, how most of the interesting characters end up as a victim or are alredy dead or something.
Robert Hammond is no exception on this matter.
What we heard about him, how he was a greedy and reckless Attorney seems to be unwasted in the Ace Attorney-Universe.
All the Def-Lawyers are the good guys, eh?
Well, Robert rightous contradicts this thinking.
It kinda also appeared in 2-4 IMO, where Phoenix found out, what a bastard Matt in fact, is or rather was.
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Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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Spoiler:
Re: Robert Hammond Appreciation thread
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BTW- SO KEEN that this thread has woken up even if the life is only short
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