Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...? : Courthouse Steps

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:38 am

Danchat

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Quote:

I wouldn't be surprised if Kokone was a Gramarye considering her "power". (Phoenix even refers her ability as such, just like he did with Apollo.)

I believe this was already discussed, but there is no way she is a Gramarye. 1 AA doesn't use overarching plots very much 2 They aren't going to reveal the spoilers back from AJ. 3 Being a 'new' game on a new platform, I'd bet there will be few refrences to the past games. Very few.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Feb 11, 2013 3:00 am

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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Auburnsun wrote:

One word: fanservice. Logically, it should have revolved around Apollo since he wasn't fully developed in GS4. Making the game star Kokone wouldn't appease the rabid Phoenix fans.

Surely, Capcom can come up with a better reason than "the fans wanted it, so we delivered"?

Danchat wrote:

Quote:

I wouldn't be surprised if Kokone was a Gramarye considering her "power". (Phoenix even refers her ability as such, just like he did with Apollo.)

I believe this was already discussed, but there is no way she is a Gramarye. 1 AA doesn't use overarching plots very much 2 They aren't going to reveal the spoilers back from AJ. 3 Being a 'new' game on a new platform, I'd bet there will be few refrences to the past games. Very few.

Actually, isn't the overarching plot behind the original trilogy exactly what ties the games together? It's not just because Phoenix came, saw, and conquered. But certainly, GS5 won't need to reference cases of past games. They'll just need to reference past cases during the missing 7 years of Phoenix out-of-court.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:20 pm

TheIdioteque

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After seeing Apollo's new artwork for GS5, I'm almost convinced that he is the going to wind up being the prosecutor in GS5. That scowl, the folded arms, the new tattered coat (does anyone besides me see a possible von Karma association? Maybe Franziska or Edgeworth trained him?), the fact that he is facing left (most prosecutors tend to face left in their artwork due to them being placed on the right side of the screen, though I suppose it could be a red herring), everything about Apollo in the new artwork just screams prosecutor. I'm not so sure that he's the silhouette that Nemi was speaking of (who says the silhouette has to be the prosecutor?), but at this point I'm almost 100% convinced that Apollo will be Phoenix's rival in the game.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:51 pm

CatMuto

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If they do have Apollo turn into a prosecutor, I hope they end up giving us a good reason - one that doesn't mean "It'd be a neat twist" or "He follows the truth now on the Prosecutor side cause they have more resources" like Edgeworth. I also thought the Jacket was kinda Karma-ish, but then.... well, it's very decorated, the way Karma's or Edgeworth's was.

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:25 pm

TheIdioteque

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The first thing I thought when I saw Apollo's new artwork was "Holy crap, that's von Karma's jacket!" Not saying that it is, or that he even has any association with the von Karmas, but it really does sorta look like the coat that Manfred von Karma wears in PW:AA. Though I suppose it could just be a coincidence.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:59 pm

Danchat

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According to the latest evidence, it seems Apollo may not be the prosecutor. Check out the topic all about it around the end to see.

Also, on the AA5 website, he's situated next to Phoenix and Kokone. Usually the prosecutor wouldn't be displayed like that...
There's a profile on him in Japenese.... and I would love if someone could translate that. That might be our final piece of evidence to close this mystery.

One last thing.... I don't think that siloutte is Apollo. It must be the prosecutor.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:09 pm

Auburnsun

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The profile doesn't mention anything we don't know. It basically amounts to this:
"omg what happened to him!????"
"is he relevant to the case?????"
"WHAT'S UP WITH THAT JACKET?"
"lol so mysterious"

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:14 am

CatMuto

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TheIdioteque wrote:

The first thing I thought when I saw Apollo's new artwork was "Holy crap, that's von Karma's jacket!" Not saying that it is, or that he even has any association with the von Karmas, but it really does sorta look like the coat that Manfred von Karma wears in PW:AA. Though I suppose it could just be a coincidence.

Aside from the fact that the jacket is darkblue, it has nothing really in common with Karma's jacket. It doesn't have heavily decorated lapels, for one thing.

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Sat Mar 16, 2013 1:13 am

TheIdioteque

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CatMuto wrote:

TheIdioteque wrote:

The first thing I thought when I saw Apollo's new artwork was "Holy crap, that's von Karma's jacket!" Not saying that it is, or that he even has any association with the von Karmas, but it really does sorta look like the coat that Manfred von Karma wears in PW:AA. Though I suppose it could just be a coincidence.

Aside from the fact that the jacket is darkblue, it has nothing really in common with Karma's jacket. It doesn't have heavily decorated lapels, for one thing.

C-A

I guess I should have also chose my wording better as I didn't mean that it was von Karma's own jacket, but that it's a very similar style to the one that he wore.

Also notice how the jacket is covering where Apollo's badge would be. I have a feeling that may be by design to make us wonder whether he's still a D.A. or a prosecutor.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Sat Mar 16, 2013 3:32 am

D.A. McCoy

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TheIdioteque wrote:

CatMuto wrote:

TheIdioteque wrote:

The first thing I thought when I saw Apollo's new artwork was "Holy crap, that's von Karma's jacket!" Not saying that it is, or that he even has any association with the von Karmas, but it really does sorta look like the coat that Manfred von Karma wears in PW:AA. Though I suppose it could just be a coincidence.

Aside from the fact that the jacket is darkblue, it has nothing really in common with Karma's jacket. It doesn't have heavily decorated lapels, for one thing.

C-A

I guess I should have also chose my wording better as I didn't mean that it was von Karma's own jacket, but that it's a very similar style to the one that he wore.

Also notice how the jacket is covering where Apollo's badge would be. I have a feeling that may be by design to make us wonder whether he's still a D.A. or a prosecutor.

The only people in the series who ever wore a jacket with that kind of collar was Manfred Von Karma and Young Edgeworth. While usually a jacket is nothing to bet anything on, in this case I'd say it could very well be a hint at what Apollo's profession is in this game.

I used to have Sam Waterston as my avatar but photobucket added a watermark and also Law & Order has been cancelled for 10 years so it's time for me to move on.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:39 pm

TheIdioteque

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ADA McCoy wrote:

The only people in the series who ever wore a jacket with that kind of collar was Manfred Von Karma and Young Edgeworth. While usually a jacket is nothing to bet anything on, in this case I'd say it could very well be a hint at what Apollo's profession is in this game.

Yeah, that's what what I really getting at when I mentioned the jacket. The fact that he's wearing a jacket very similar to the ones that von Karma and Edgeworth wear is very telling.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Sat Mar 16, 2013 7:20 pm

CatMuto

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Of course, technically that means nothing - it's like saying how every murderer in the GS games always had some kind of pink on their sprite. It works for some of the cases, but later on, colors go away and not EVERY murder wears pink or fuchsia or a similar color shade.

Spoiler: Off the top of my head, murderers who had pink/fuchsia

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:59 am

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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The idea of Apollo roaring in rage and smashing his head against the wall is too funny to ignore.

Of course he's fine enough to get up and walk around, but usually courts don't allow people with bandages still on to stand in court. Yes, this is AA we're talking about, but they at least have a rule about that. Godot only got his chance because he hid his injury. No one knew about Nick's amnesia case, and it passed by anyway. But Franzy was locked at a clinic after being shot in the shoulder and furiously upset that she couldn't make it to court.

The jacket most likely looks to be a gift or loan. If the new prosecutor is actually the original owner of said jacket, that would be interesting. He and Apollo may have much closer ties than anyone could have guessed.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:12 am

CatMuto

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Granted, Franziska was stopped from being the prosecutor because she had a bullet in her shoulder - I suppose even real life court would change the prosecutor in that case. Also, I find it hilariously ironic that she was shot in the right shoulder. As for why she didn't take over the next court days...... well, in terms of story, they needed a "good" prosecutor to prolong the trial for Phoenix and Gumshoe. Otherwise, perhaps the doctors had practically forbidden Franziska to leave the hospital.
Although she is, of course, not somebody who would listen to doctors.

Quote:

The jacket most likely looks to be a gift or loan. If the new prosecutor is actually the original owner of said jacket, that would be interesting. He and Apollo may have much closer ties than anyone could have guessed.

Are you saying this could be the appearance of Apollo's father?

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:28 pm

ChiefWakamakamu

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I really wanted the new prosecutor to by Maya. I don't know why, but I had established that in my head as the coolest narrative possibility.

But Apollo would be interesting to see too. Lends to an interesting dynamic.

Seeing how Apollo is all bandaged up, I want his character quirk to be talking about his injuries like he is some veteran of some great war years ago. A spoof of the jaded 'nam vet stereotype.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:33 pm

CatMuto

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........Maya. ...why Maya?
Not saying that it would be impossible for Maya to become a lawyer, but considering her personality and view of the world, I'd sorta think she'd be much more likely to become a defense attorney, rather than prosecutor. Especially, can you imagine what it'd be like if Maya and Phoenix were on opposite ends of the courtroom? As soon as she'd see him break down, she'd help him and jeapordize her own case.

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 pm

ChiefWakamakamu

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CatMuto wrote:

........Maya. ...why Maya?
Not saying that it would be impossible for Maya to become a lawyer, but considering her personality and view of the world, I'd sorta think she'd be much more likely to become a defense attorney, rather than prosecutor. Especially, can you imagine what it'd be like if Maya and Phoenix were on opposite ends of the courtroom? As soon as she'd see him break down, she'd help him and jeapordize her own case.

C-A

I think the fact that her personality was more in line with being a Defense Attorney originally was what made it interesting to me. The whole thought was, "A lot can happen in 7 years," and it would be cool to harness that for narrative drama. It would just be really interesting to have one of Phoenix's old ally's return with a dramatic change in there character, and spend much of the game figuring out what happened to them.

Though I don't know how you could win a case against a prosecutor that could challenge the Dead. =P

I never claimed it was a well thought out wish, I just had fun thinking about it.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Mon Mar 18, 2013 11:49 pm

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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CatMuto wrote:

Are you saying this could be the appearance of Apollo's father?

C-A

Oh the possibilities... for bad fanfiction.

:odoroki:

"Sorry, Mr. Wright, but it turns out I'm the son of a prosecutor, so I'll have to follow in his footsteps instead! C ya."
:nick:

"...What. Apollo, get back here! I still need you as our mascot!"
:odoroki:

"Heck no!"

And that's why Nick became a DA again. /jk

Joking aside, it could be a memoir of someone like his father or whoever. It's slightly tattered, so it's not something he happened to buy. Said previous owner could have even been at that trial until it was bombed. No one died in it, so he/she should still be alive.

Or, that mystery person could be already gone, but it's not because of the bombing incident.

Honestly, I'm not throwing out the idea that it could have belonged to his father. I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't, though.

ChiefWakamakamu wrote:

Though I don't know how you could win a case against a prosecutor that could challenge the Dead. =P

Do you mean channel the dead? I've never heard of Maya fighting spirits.

And this sort of story is NOT what makes AA so memorable... especially with a character who we've known for so long.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:22 am

ChiefWakamakamu

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Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

ChiefWakamakamu wrote:

Though I don't know how you could win a case against a prosecutor that could challenge the Dead. =P

Do you mean channel the dead? I've never heard of Maya fighting spirits.

And this sort of story is NOT what makes AA so memorable... especially with a character who we've known for so long.

OBJECTION!

The trope of people having changed over time has been pulled multiple times in the series, and used pretty well. And with a 7 year time gap -- which saw the trope used with Phoenix of all people -- there is plenty of room for a story like this. Not saying it's the best direction, but it is a valid one.

And Maya fights spirits all the time. Just not on screen. It's her hobby. Canon.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:52 am

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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ChiefWakamakamu wrote:

Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

ChiefWakamakamu wrote:

Though I don't know how you could win a case against a prosecutor that could challenge the Dead. =P

Do you mean channel the dead? I've never heard of Maya fighting spirits.

And this sort of story is NOT what makes AA so memorable... especially with a character who we've known for so long.

OBJECTION!

The trope of people having changed over time has been pulled multiple times in the series, and used pretty well. And with a 7 year time gap -- which saw the trope used with Phoenix of all people -- there is plenty of room for a story like this. Not saying it's the best direction, but it is a valid one.

And Maya fights spirits all the time. Just not on screen. It's her hobby. Canon.

But I never said it wasn't valid. :sawit:

I agree that in Phoenix's case, it works. He loses his job and his role as the main character - more important of the two is the latter. With so much offscreen time, he uses it to its maximum potential... by turning around the entire problem that's plagued him for his entire attorney life. That is impressive.

However, with Maya, that might not work out so well. For one thing, her potential has always laid in her spiritual abilities and willpower. For another, Mia knew where Maya's potential lied and left the clan in support of her. And as the current Master of Kurain, she has a heavy obligation to her duty and to Pearl. But above all is how specifically her story was resolved by the end of T&T: training to become the Master. If there's anything at all that forces her to turn from that, it's going to feel like a pull from one's rear end, so to speak.

Besides, with 7 whole years of spiritual training, Maya is going to join the roster of badasses in AAverse. Fighting spirits won't just be a hobby; it'll be her freakin' job.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Tue Mar 19, 2013 9:33 am

CatMuto

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I'm never too convinced by the idea that Maya indeed chose to remain the Master post 3-5, she was the Master for the majority of the case, but would she keep at it? After all, when she gets onto the stand in 3-5, she says she is working at the Wright and Co. Law Firm because she wants nothing to do with the Fey Clan anymore. So while she is Master at that time, it could be that she eventually gave up the position and handed it over to Pearl.

But if they made Maya the prosecutor in GS5 - that would be a huge WHAT THE FUCK moment and I'm sure it'd be impossible to tell us a good reason in one game. They'd have to string out the reason, give us maybe two games to explain why Maya gave up on the Fey Clan, why she decided to enroll in Law School like her sister and then pick to be a prosecutor. Because.. Maya as a prosecutor, it sounds like a bad fanfic.

And that whole channeling spirits during court, that is pointless and shouldn't be admissable.
Yeah our little Judgey believes in spirits and channeling now, but that doesn't mean the new Jury would believe it. We can't rely on the Judge to swallow everything anymore, we have to be able to make the Jury see our stand point. (Which is exactly why I don't want an emotion system for the witness, but a bar at the bottom that shows how the Jury is currently standing in terms of a verdict...)

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:24 pm

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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CatMuto wrote:

I'm never too convinced by the idea that Maya indeed chose to remain the Master post 3-5, she was the Master for the majority of the case, but would she keep at it? After all, when she gets onto the stand in 3-5, she says she is working at the Wright and Co. Law Firm because she wants nothing to do with the Fey Clan anymore. So while she is Master at that time, it could be that she eventually gave up the position and handed it over to Pearl.

That was when Maya felt disheartened, thanks to Morgan Fey. After the trial was resolved, she finally committed herself to the clan's legacy. In any case, I don't know if Pearl would feel that she'd be ready to take on that title, even if Maya wanted to pass it to her instead. Perhaps not until GS5 or after, when Pearl has hit 17 herself...

Quote:

And that whole channeling spirits during court, that is pointless and shouldn't be admissable.
Yeah our little Judgey believes in spirits and channeling now, but that doesn't mean the new Jury would believe it. We can't rely on the Judge to swallow everything anymore, we have to be able to make the Jury see our stand point. (Which is exactly why I don't want an emotion system for the witness, but a bar at the bottom that shows how the Jury is currently standing in terms of a verdict...)

C-A

That's something I've been wishing to see too: some indication of how well you're doing in the trial via jury opinion. I hope GS5 will implement it into an end-of-trial rating system or something. It'd work really well with the game's direction.

But the Heart Scope is still cool.

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:33 am

CatMuto

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Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

That's something I've been wishing to see too: some indication of how well you're doing in the trial via jury opinion. I hope GS5 will implement it into an end-of-trial rating system or something. It'd work really well with the game's direction.

But the Heart Scope is still cool.

Which is what I wanted as a mechanic once the Jury System was implemented into the game. Like I said in other threads the Jury decision could be a bar at the bottom with Not Guilty at the left and Guilty on the right and the bar fills up the better you do.
Screw up, it goes towards the right.
And I would love it if they added in the fact that the Jury have prejudices, so depending on the defendant, they might be more leaning towards the Guilty side from the beginning and you just have to manage to convince them that the defendant actually is Not Guilty.

The emotion thing is a nice idea, but... Heart Scope!
Heart Freaking Scope! That doesn't sound like it belongs into a GS game at all!
It... it belongs into a Magical Girl series - "Heart Scope! Fill them with good feelings~ Heart Beat~" *insert sparkly musical score*

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:22 pm

Rubia Ryu the Royal

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CatMuto wrote:

Which is what I wanted as a mechanic once the Jury System was implemented into the game. Like I said in other threads the Jury decision could be a bar at the bottom with Not Guilty at the left and Guilty on the right and the bar fills up the better you do.
Screw up, it goes towards the right.
And I would love it if they added in the fact that the Jury have prejudices, so depending on the defendant, they might be more leaning towards the Guilty side from the beginning and you just have to manage to convince them that the defendant actually is Not Guilty.

That's how I pictured it too. The dev team might still have time to include it somehow, even if there wasn't anything like it in the demo (but the demo was released pretty early, so there's room to move).

Yet by this late in the stage, I can't see them adding in anything more complicated than a rating system at the end of a trial. The extra tidbits added toward model-building are easy to do compared to the amount of programming involved. If they're planning to move on schedule with a release date this year, they need to hurry.

Quote:

The emotion thing is a nice idea, but... Heart Scope!
Heart Freaking Scope! That doesn't sound like it belongs into a GS game at all!
It... it belongs into a Magical Girl series - "Heart Scope! Fill them with good feelings~ Heart Beat~" *insert sparkly musical score*

C-A

Kokone looks like a mix of IdolMaster and Vocaloid stuffed into one character design. Plus, she acts like a shojo character and often makes pretty poses.

Hm, now that I think about it, Apollo looks like he's from a shonen anime, complete with decorative bandages and a jacket hanging on his shoulders. Now he just needs someone to fight.

Oh God, GyakuSai. I was just kidding about the teen drama! :beef:

Augh, the horrible fanfiction that will arise from this...! I will suffocate on my own laughter, dammit!

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Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:21 pm

beterbomen

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CatMuto wrote:

Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

That's something I've been wishing to see too: some indication of how well you're doing in the trial via jury opinion. I hope GS5 will implement it into an end-of-trial rating system or something. It'd work really well with the game's direction.

But the Heart Scope is still cool.

Which is what I wanted as a mechanic once the Jury System was implemented into the game. Like I said in other threads the Jury decision could be a bar at the bottom with Not Guilty at the left and Guilty on the right and the bar fills up the better you do.
Screw up, it goes towards the right.
And I would love it if they added in the fact that the Jury have prejudices, so depending on the defendant, they might be more leaning towards the Guilty side from the beginning and you just have to manage to convince them that the defendant actually is Not Guilty.

C-A

It would be a nice mechanic, sure, but would it really be a fitting one? For a game about Law and Order, maybe, but not for Ace Attorney.
AA has always been focussed on telling its (extremely) liniar story. You might think that's a bad thing, you might think it's a good thing, but you can't deny that its one of the series key staples. A mechanic like this wouldn't fit in that kind of arangement. What you're proposing is more suited to a more free-roaming court game, where you can pick between different angles of inquiry and may or may not point out contradictions. An LA Noire like system, basically. In a game like that, where the main point is to convince the Jury of your case, a system like that would be right at home.

But Ace Attorney is focussed on telling one - and only one - story, that is not so much about proving your point as it is about figuring out the truth; proving your point is just a means to an end.
Also, as we've seen in AJ, a single person voting guilty can make for a guilty verdict, should the evidence be disfavorable to the defendant. A bar or anything alike would only mean that you can only win if you convince the jury of your point 100%, meaning no margine for errors at all.
That's not how Ace Attorney plays, and probably not how it should be played (even though we probably all do the thing where we secretly reload after every screw-up). For such a feature to be implemented would require a complete overhaul of how AA plays out. In other words, it would have to stop being an Ace Attorney game.

If such a bar were to be implemented, the only way I can see it being used would be as a story element, with zero actual influence from the player on the result. Basically, it would just be there to indicate exactly how screwed you are in a calculative way. In other words, it would be a big waste of space, developement time, and, in the end, atmosphere.

Again, I'm not saying it is a bad idea, just not one that would work in an Ace Attorney game.

Serve the Story - that's one of my rules.
--------------
That wasn't an objection, honest! I was just pointing someone to the bus stop!

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:36 am

D.A. McCoy

Doing the drywall at the new McDonalds

Gender: Male

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 1:46 am

Posts: 1586

beterbomen wrote:

CatMuto wrote:

Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

That's something I've been wishing to see too: some indication of how well you're doing in the trial via jury opinion. I hope GS5 will implement it into an end-of-trial rating system or something. It'd work really well with the game's direction.

But the Heart Scope is still cool.

Which is what I wanted as a mechanic once the Jury System was implemented into the game. Like I said in other threads the Jury decision could be a bar at the bottom with Not Guilty at the left and Guilty on the right and the bar fills up the better you do.
Screw up, it goes towards the right.
And I would love it if they added in the fact that the Jury have prejudices, so depending on the defendant, they might be more leaning towards the Guilty side from the beginning and you just have to manage to convince them that the defendant actually is Not Guilty.

C-A

It would be a nice mechanic, sure, but would it really be a fitting one? For a game about Law and Order, maybe, but not for Ace Attorney.
AA has always been focussed on telling its (extremely) liniar story. You might think that's a bad thing, you might think it's a good thing, but you can't deny that its one of the series key staples. A mechanic like this wouldn't fit in that kind of arangement. What you're proposing is more suited to a more free-roaming court game, where you can pick between different angles of inquiry and may or may not point out contradictions. An LA Noire like system, basically. In a game like that, where the main point is to convince the Jury of your case, a system like that would be right at home.

But Ace Attorney is focussed on telling one - and only one - story, that is not so much about proving your point as it is about figuring out the truth; proving your point is just a means to an end.
Also, as we've seen in AJ, a single person voting guilty can make for a guilty verdict, should the evidence be disfavorable to the defendant. A bar or anything alike would only mean that you can only win if you convince the jury of your point 100%, meaning no margine for errors at all.
That's not how Ace Attorney plays, and probably not how it should be played (even though we probably all do the thing where we secretly reload after every screw-up). For such a feature to be implemented would require a complete overhaul of how AA plays out. In other words, it would have to stop being an Ace Attorney game.

If such a bar were to be implemented, the only way I can see it being used would be as a story element, with zero actual influence from the player on the result. Basically, it would just be there to indicate exactly how screwed you are in a calculative way. In other words, it would be a big waste of space, developement time, and, in the end, atmosphere.

Again, I'm not saying it is a bad idea, just not one that would work in an Ace Attorney game.

I had thought of a similar Jury bar to the one Cat Muto had discussed, based on the gameplay system of Law and Order: Legacies. But I also know what you're talking about and how it would change the gameplay if it really had an effect. So I would say the easiest way to do this would be to replace the "life" bar with a "jury bar" but have it function the exact same way. The more you screw up, the more they are leaning with the prosecution, and when you run out of life the jury finds the client guilty right then and there. Don't know why something like that wouldn't work.

I used to have Sam Waterston as my avatar but photobucket added a watermark and also Law & Order has been cancelled for 10 years so it's time for me to move on.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:22 pm

CatMuto

Gender: Female

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:23 pm

Posts: 9918

Quote:

So I would say the easiest way to do this would be to replace the "life" bar with a "jury bar" but have it function the exact same way.

Pretty much what I meant, yes.
I mean, up to now, if your Life Bar depleted you got the Guilty Verdict - even if you got it at a place where it was absolutely plainly obvious that your client is innocent. But I'm not getting into that. But if they do exchange the Life Bar with the Jury bar, I hope they'll keep it the way they did in GS2 and GS3.
If you screw up during court day and start a new section of the Case, the bar will not be entirely refilled/set to default, because the Jury simply remembers the mistakes you made previously and how it influenced their idea.

C-A

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:12 pm

beterbomen

Avatar out for lunch.

Gender: Male

Location: Nowhere near you.

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 9:55 pm

Posts: 234

CatMuto wrote:

Quote:

So I would say the easiest way to do this would be to replace the "life" bar with a "jury bar" but have it function the exact same way.

Pretty much what I meant, yes.
I mean, up to now, if your Life Bar depleted you got the Guilty Verdict - even if you got it at a place where it was absolutely plainly obvious that your client is innocent. But I'm not getting into that. But if they do exchange the Life Bar with the Jury bar, I hope they'll keep it the way they did in GS2 and GS3.
If you screw up during court day and start a new section of the Case, the bar will not be entirely refilled/set to default, because the Jury simply remembers the mistakes you made previously and how it influenced their idea.

C-A

Fair enough, but in that case it should also be possible to refill the bar by making valid assersions, either by getting a point right the first time, or just at pre-determined points in the plot.

Serve the Story - that's one of my rules.
--------------
That wasn't an objection, honest! I was just pointing someone to the bus stop!

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:57 pm

Rubia Ryu the Royal

Racing through the sky like a Missile

Gender: Female

Location: LA, Japanifornia

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:17 am

Posts: 6180

beterbomen wrote:

CatMuto wrote:

Quote:

So I would say the easiest way to do this would be to replace the "life" bar with a "jury bar" but have it function the exact same way.

Pretty much what I meant, yes.
I mean, up to now, if your Life Bar depleted you got the Guilty Verdict - even if you got it at a place where it was absolutely plainly obvious that your client is innocent. But I'm not getting into that. But if they do exchange the Life Bar with the Jury bar, I hope they'll keep it the way they did in GS2 and GS3.
If you screw up during court day and start a new section of the Case, the bar will not be entirely refilled/set to default, because the Jury simply remembers the mistakes you made previously and how it influenced their idea.

C-A

Fair enough, but in that case it should also be possible to refill the bar by making valid assersions, either by getting a point right the first time, or just at pre-determined points in the plot.

So basically, the original life bar actually becomes more integrated with the plot? That's not a bad idea.

Though, I wonder about the requirements to apply it in-game. Does the bar begin at full health or half? For a "fairer" trial, I would believe the latter, but then the bar would be too narrow. I suggest the bar is lengthened and/or divided into a greater number of sections, so penalties can still be varied without putting too much pressure on the defense's side.

And likewise, if the player does well enough, penalties could be applied to the prosecution as well. Of course, for the sake of story writing, the prosecution won't be taking a lot of penalties. And again for the writing, certain points during a case - be it in our out of court - can cause the bar to shift from one side to the other, so your starting point for a trial day isn't always smack dab in the middle (though at the start of any given trial, the bar is never leaning toward the defense).

But then again, would it really be alright to replace the original life bar? I can understand attaching a separate bar to it, but the original should stay. It keeps a better track of how many penalties you've taken throughout the trial, even if the jury has a good opinion of the defense. It seems counter-intuitive that the defense would still lose a trial even with the jury backing them up, but it's entirely possible... especially when you consider the game's theme.

Hm... now how am I supposed to include the Heart Scope in all of this? Should it be permissible for the entirety of the game, or are there points when you aren't allowed to use it? I'm off to ponder.

The home of the Gyakuten Saiban vs Ace Attorney blog: http://gyakutengagotoku.tumblr.com
1/3/19 edit: The project has officially been moved to a new blog at https://gsvsaa.blogspot.com/ Further updates will be pending.

AA fanfiction archive: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31369
Yakuza/RGG fanfiction archive: https://archiveofourown.org/users/rubia ... /rubia_ryu
My misc translation and work promos here at http://rubiaryutheroyal.tumblr.com

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:14 am

Gnobo

State Alchemist

Gender: Male

Rank: Prosecutor

Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:36 am

Posts: 704

*sigh* Well guys, this theory was really exciting to support and all, but I'm sorry to say that it looks like our Mystery Prosecutor has officially been revealed.

Spoiler:

Not saying this guy isn't awesome (because he really is!) but it's a little dissapointing to see this little theory not make it to canon.

But who knows? Maybe the new guy'll be really interesting, and from what we know of him right now, it looks like he has a lot of potential.

Although I'm still suspicious of Apollo's actual role in the game.

The Amazing Forehead

Also check out some of my art: AA Pairing's Kids, Other AA related stuff

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:22 am

Pierre

Gettin' Old!

Gender: Male

Location: Scotland

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:30 pm

Posts: 14363

Gnobo wrote:

*sigh* Well guys, this theory was really exciting to support and all, but I'm sorry to say that it looks like our Mystery Prosecutor has officially been revealed.

Spoiler:

Not saying this guy isn't awesome (because he really is!) but it's a little dissapointing to see this little theory not make it to canon.

But who knows? Maybe the new guy'll be really interesting, and from what we know of him right now, it looks like he has a lot of potential.

Although I'm still suspicious of Apollo's actual role in the game.

He's confirmed as a defence attorney and playable, looks like we'll see at least a bit of Apollo's perspective too.
The official site has images showing first-person talking to Phoenix and the playable character has typically been a defence attorney so it's probably Apollo.

Plus there's actual screenshots of him behind the desk.

Though I never really thought Apollo as a prosecutor was good or believable...just didn't think it suited his character arc enough.

I wonder who got closest in the "Pick the Prosecutor" contest. Wonder if Croik still has those prizes.

Made by Chesu+Zombee

You thought you could be safe in your courts, with your laws and attorneys to protect you. In this world only I am law, my word is fact, my power is absolute.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:33 am

Gnobo

State Alchemist

Gender: Male

Rank: Prosecutor

Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:36 am

Posts: 704

Pierre wrote:

Gnobo wrote:

*sigh* Well guys, this theory was really exciting to support and all, but I'm sorry to say that it looks like our Mystery Prosecutor has officially been revealed.

Spoiler:

Not saying this guy isn't awesome (because he really is!) but it's a little dissapointing to see this little theory not make it to canon.

But who knows? Maybe the new guy'll be really interesting, and from what we know of him right now, it looks like he has a lot of potential.

Although I'm still suspicious of Apollo's actual role in the game.

He's confirmed as a defence attorney and playable, looks like we'll see at least a bit of Apollo's perspective too.
The official site has images showing first-person talking to Phoenix and the playable character has typically been a defence attorney so it's probably Apollo.

Plus there's actual screenshots of him behind the desk.

Though I never really thought Apollo as a prosecutor was good or believable...just didn't think it suited his character arc enough.

I wonder who got closest in the "Pick the Prosecutor" contest. Wonder if Croik still has those prizes.

There's still the mystery of why Apollo's wearing an eyepatch, tattered coat, and possibly no attorney's badge in his first appearance.

When we first saw him, he looked pretty beat up. Nowadays, he looks just fine, and he's even taking on the second case of the game with Kokone.

Could the second case be a flashback to before the courthouse bombing or does someone or something else injure him in a later case?

The Amazing Forehead

Also check out some of my art: AA Pairing's Kids, Other AA related stuff

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 12:38 am

Pierre

Gettin' Old!

Gender: Male

Location: Scotland

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:30 pm

Posts: 14363

Gnobo wrote:

Pierre wrote:

Gnobo wrote:

*sigh* Well guys, this theory was really exciting to support and all, but I'm sorry to say that it looks like our Mystery Prosecutor has officially been revealed.

Spoiler:

Not saying this guy isn't awesome (because he really is!) but it's a little dissapointing to see this little theory not make it to canon.

But who knows? Maybe the new guy'll be really interesting, and from what we know of him right now, it looks like he has a lot of potential.

Although I'm still suspicious of Apollo's actual role in the game.

He's confirmed as a defence attorney and playable, looks like we'll see at least a bit of Apollo's perspective too.
The official site has images showing first-person talking to Phoenix and the playable character has typically been a defence attorney so it's probably Apollo.

Plus there's actual screenshots of him behind the desk.

Though I never really thought Apollo as a prosecutor was good or believable...just didn't think it suited his character arc enough.

I wonder who got closest in the "Pick the Prosecutor" contest. Wonder if Croik still has those prizes.

There's still the mystery of why Apollo's wearing an eyepatch, tattered coat, and possibly no attorney's badge in his first appearance.

When we first saw him, he looked pretty beat up. Nowadays, he looks just fine, and he's even taking on the second case of the game with Kokone.

Could the second case be a flashback to before the courthouse bombing or does someone or something else injure him in a later case?

Why can't he appear in the first case?
Possibly a witness to the bombing hence the character model.
Second case can be later on once he's recovered. Seems simple to me.

Made by Chesu+Zombee

You thought you could be safe in your courts, with your laws and attorneys to protect you. In this world only I am law, my word is fact, my power is absolute.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:01 am

Gnobo

State Alchemist

Gender: Male

Rank: Prosecutor

Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:36 am

Posts: 704

Pierre wrote:

Why can't he appear in the first case?
Possibly a witness to the bombing hence the character model.
Second case can be later on once he's recovered. Seems simple to me.

It'd be disappointing for something serious like Apollo getting severely injured from an explosion or becoming really serious and bitter to just be resolved within the very first case. The way it's been teased makes it look like this is supposed to be a major part of the plot or a major step in Apollo's character development.

Also, speaking of that tattered coat. The official GS5 website got rid of the old profile showcasing Pirate Polly and now there's just regular old Apollo, healthy as ever. I wonder why they're not mentioning the coat anymore?

The Amazing Forehead

Also check out some of my art: AA Pairing's Kids, Other AA related stuff

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 4:37 am

Ropfa

Dracarys!

Gender: Male

Location: In a courtroom, for some reason

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:00 pm

Posts: 1224

I'm calling it. The new prosecutor is actually innocent of whatever crime he's accused of and Kokone is the true culprit.

Also, this: Pywright tutorial for beginners And this: Pokemon crossover case

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 4:42 am

Blak The Great

☆☆☆ Kira ☆☆☆

Gender: Male

Location: Nippon-Weeb-Land

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:25 pm

Posts: 2512

Ropfa wrote:

I'm calling it. The new prosecutor is actually innocent of whatever crime he's accused of and Kokone is the true culprit.

Nope. Turns out Jin is actually the Judge and the Judge is the true criminal. *nods affirmatively* Yup yup yup. I'm right. Everyone else is wrong!

I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 7:46 am

Rubia Ryu the Royal

Racing through the sky like a Missile

Gender: Female

Location: LA, Japanifornia

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:17 am

Posts: 6180

Blak The Great wrote:

Ropfa wrote:

I'm calling it. The new prosecutor is actually innocent of whatever crime he's accused of and Kokone is the true culprit.

Nope. Turns out Jin is actually the Judge and the Judge is the true criminal. *nods affirmatively* Yup yup yup. I'm right. Everyone else is wrong!

As if I needed more reasons to buy this game.

But we can't throw out the possibility that Case 2 is a flashback case. Thanks to the bombing incident, Nick takes up defending once more, given that Apollo becomes a witness of sorts to the bombing. No news on Trucy yet, but the way they're hiding her could either mean that something bad happened to her or... yeah, something bad happened. It's another reason why Nick isn't particularly relaxed in the intro scene of the game.

Besides, a random visit to a monster-themed village is in no way related to a courthouse bombing... or is it?

The home of the Gyakuten Saiban vs Ace Attorney blog: http://gyakutengagotoku.tumblr.com
1/3/19 edit: The project has officially been moved to a new blog at https://gsvsaa.blogspot.com/ Further updates will be pending.

AA fanfiction archive: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31369
Yakuza/RGG fanfiction archive: https://archiveofourown.org/users/rubia ... /rubia_ryu
My misc translation and work promos here at http://rubiaryutheroyal.tumblr.com

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:09 am

Blak The Great

☆☆☆ Kira ☆☆☆

Gender: Male

Location: Nippon-Weeb-Land

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:25 pm

Posts: 2512

Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:

Blak The Great wrote:

Ropfa wrote:

I'm calling it. The new prosecutor is actually innocent of whatever crime he's accused of and Kokone is the true culprit.

Nope. Turns out Jin is actually the Judge and the Judge is the true criminal. *nods affirmatively* Yup yup yup. I'm right. Everyone else is wrong!

As if I needed more reasons to buy this game.

But we can't throw out the possibility that Case 2 is a flashback case. Thanks to the bombing incident, Nick takes up defending once more, given that Apollo becomes a witness of sorts to the bombing. No news on Trucy yet, but the way they're hiding her could either mean that something bad happened to her or... yeah, something bad happened. It's another reason why Nick isn't particularly relaxed in the intro scene of the game.

Besides, a random visit to a monster-themed village is in no way related to a courthouse bombing... or is it?

Case 2 could actually be a time-skip after Apollo receives augmentations to repair his maimed body. Distraught at his sudden change, he requests that his vocal chords to also undergo the augmentation. His now enhanced "Chords of Steel" are now powerful enough to literally blow away the audience and anyone else that dares question the logic of the "Rooster Spike". Though the new enhancement DOES come with a price. The ability is volume sensitive meaning that players will shout as loud as they can into the mic in order to win the case. Don't worry though, you can still use the stock method of pressing the "Objection" button. It just won't be as awesome.

Now you're speculating what happened to Trucy? Well that's so much as obvious. Trucy became a top-tier magician. As she was experimenting with REAL magic, she accidentally cast a spell that bounced off mirrors and hit her directly. It turned her into a picture for some reason. Phoenix was around at the time she was practicing and came rushing into the room to find Trucy on the ground as a picture. She could still talk, so she told him what happened of course. Having been no stranger to strange things Phoenix accepted it and placed her picture in his locket. Whenever he gets lonely he talks to Trucy in the locket and vows to change her back.

This is where Jin comes into play. Jin may LOOK like a 40 year old samurai, but that's because he IS. Jin holds a mystic power that can turn Trucy back to normal, but that's only if Phoenix can't beat him in court. Course Phoenix beats him... multiple times, and Jin plays it off as "Beginner's luck".

Yup yup yup. I'm a genius.

I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:15 am

Rubia Ryu the Royal

Racing through the sky like a Missile

Gender: Female

Location: LA, Japanifornia

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:17 am

Posts: 6180

Apollo as prosecutor? Pssh, naw. Apollo as Final Boss Villain? HELLS YEAH. (And I have you to thank, Blak.)

Either that, or Charley stayed young by eating someone. It's the only explanation for why he's still there.

The home of the Gyakuten Saiban vs Ace Attorney blog: http://gyakutengagotoku.tumblr.com
1/3/19 edit: The project has officially been moved to a new blog at https://gsvsaa.blogspot.com/ Further updates will be pending.

AA fanfiction archive: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31369
Yakuza/RGG fanfiction archive: https://archiveofourown.org/users/rubia ... /rubia_ryu
My misc translation and work promos here at http://rubiaryutheroyal.tumblr.com

Re: Could the new Prosecutor be a familiar face...?

Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:30 am

CatMuto

Gender: Female

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:23 pm

Posts: 9918

Gnobo wrote:

Spoiler:

The fuck is that on his shoulder!? :ack:

It looks kind of like an eagle, but the face looks like a cat!!

C-A