Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 3:21 am

Immortal FeatherLLS

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After playing GS1-2, haven't completed 3 or 4 yet. I can honestly say that I am SO SICK AND TIRED OF MURDER! Seriously, I love a good mystery but why they hell do I have to be so involved.

*Here, look at this dead guy's photo! Now explain in seriously detail how they it happened, Lets not forget the dead body! There's the murderer, go up and talk to him/her like nothing is happening. There's the dead guy again.

Thought I was going to get a normal trail in 3-2, then they pulled that from me.
Can anyone say thev honestly say that don't want something new from the series beside new characters/characters development.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 3:50 am

axl99

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I suppose murder is a lot more interesting than robbery or assault or a simple lawsuit to Capcom.

I noticed most of the cases revolved around murder as well, but I never gave too much thought about it. Maybe it was just Phoenix's specialty.

Perhaps in future games they could try putting in a high profile fraud case somewhere. Ooh or maybe something to do with COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT! Not that it wouldn't be worth considering just for kicks, I mean it could add to the humour that's already there.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 5:49 am

Immortal FeatherLLS

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True, there could be more humor in the cases. But they do somehow mix someone getting killed with humor, still don't know how they're doing that.
Just hope for something different in GS5, cause I know I'm not buying GS4. I don't wanna deal with all that death, gettin kinda tired.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:16 am

Connor?!

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I would like to see thievery and attempted murder covered more often than it has, but otherwise I don't really see much of a problem with murder mysteries. They're generally more exciting.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 9:03 am

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I have no problem with them all being murder cases because of the way pw games are they are always interesting and well done and always seem to link to a past case 2 lol but thats the fun of pw plus murder cases as previously said are more exciting to investigate.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 1:05 pm

Aijiru

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Also murder cases can't have the victim as a witness, which makes them more complicated to solve.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 2:51 pm

Croik

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I think the only problem with doing anything that *isn't* murder is that it runs the risk of being boring. How exciting can it be to defend a client in a civil suit, when you've been saving innocent people from getting the death penalty all this time? I like when they mix other crimes in with murder (like theft and blackmail) but ultimately Phoenix/Odoroki are criminal defense lawyers. It's not like they're going to start suing people.

Though it would be interesting to have an assault where the victim survived and spends the duration of the trial in a coma or something.

Also, GS4 may also deal heavily with murder, but by refusing to try it you'll be missing 4-2, which is one of the best cases in the series (IMO). It's hilarious and just plain awesome.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 5:33 pm

Count Scofula

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I did wonder why the only crime that really comes up is murder, but I don't think it gets stale. After all, the murder methods are usually interesting and differ with cases, and there are enough plot twists to keep you on your toes, not to mention the script is engaging.

In my opinion, although there is a lot of murder, it doesn't decrease the playability. If that makes sense.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 5:34 pm

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 5:56 pm

Immortal FeatherLLS

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Croik wrote:

Also, GS4 may also deal heavily with murder, but by refusing to try it you'll be missing 4-2, which is one of the best cases in the series (IMO). It's hilarious and just plain awesome.

I don't know, maybe it's that I have problem with murder :yogi:

When the English version comes out I'm sure that I would have changed my mind by then, but right at the moment it's kinda bothersome.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:13 pm

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Croik wrote:

I think the only problem with doing anything that *isn't* murder is that it runs the risk of being boring. How exciting can it be to defend a client in a civil suit, when you've been saving innocent people from getting the death penalty all this time?

For me, the thrill of the case always came from trying to win it. After Turnabout Goodbyes the meme began to tire. Granted, there are some cases where murder would be the only solution where it'd pack the same emotional effect, but emotion and the likes can still be conveyed aplenty throughout non-murder trials such as theft, attempted murder, arson, etc.

...Come to think of it, what would it be like to defend someone for being accused of being a vigilante?

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:49 pm

Mr. Bear Jew

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Personally, I don't have a problem with murder cases and defending the innocent all the time. However, I would like to see more cases like 3-2 where they have two seemingly unrelated crimes going on at once and then turn out to be connected to each other in some plausible, non-plothole-riddled way.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:55 pm

DomSaxton

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I'd like to see something else,
Maybe suicide, rape and assualt all mixed into one case

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:20 am

MercuryKitten

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I don't think they would do rape....

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Sun Sep 02, 2007 4:59 am

Daramue

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Yeah, I always wondered that myself, but I always thought it was because of Phoenix's “motto” of sorts: To defend the innocent who can't defend themselves. Without it being a murder, that can only be taken in the loosest, most unimportant sense. That's the way I view it, anyway.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:13 am

Immortal FeatherLLS

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MercuryKitten wrote:

I don't think they would do rape....

See, that's what I don't understand. WHY wouldn't they do a rape case?! Someone got Killed in f'ed up way in almost every game, so someone gets raped, you could still do a case about it.

I'm looking at it like this.

-Someone just got killed in a gruesome way
-While investing the case and in court, let me shove this picture of the dead body in your face for about 5 minutes.
-You could be talking to the killer, he/she is right in your face.
etc.

It's just a total mind fuck for me. :yuusaku:

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:08 am

Blademaster_Orca

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RufustheJudge wrote:

MercuryKitten wrote:

I don't think they would do rape....

See, that's what I don't understand. WHY wouldn't they do a rape case?!

Why? One, rape cases aren't nearly as diverse or unique as murder cases. They're different, yes, but being different does not mean it's better.

Two, and more importantly, rape implies/features strong sexual content, which would net the game(s) an M rating instantly, something I'm sure Capcom wouldn't want for a series that's been fitting nicely into the T rating.

Not to mention the negative press this would get. Even a slight mention of sex gets people into a frenzy, outright rape would be much worse.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:30 am

Toby Danger

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Murders usually work best for mystery stories, as there's usually a lot of emotion and drama motivating it, which always makes for great reading. Would the various criminals/witnesses from the games be half as likable as there are if they didn't have some deep motivation for what they did?

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Mon Sep 03, 2007 12:00 pm

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This one's a no brainer, really. If you're looking for a gritty and realistic lawyer sim, Phoenix Wright is probably not for you. Sure there are plenty of people dying in PW games, but they're always portrayed in a very tame way (no bursting guts, chopped liver, or what have you.) IMO, despite all the serious drama that goes on in the game, PW is always about the humour first, then the drama second. Not the other way around. It doesn't take itself seriously.

about the possiblity of rape case... I just don't see how you can make fun of rape. Actually, well, you probably can, but you'd be treading on thin ice here. Remember, we're talking about NINTENDO here, and although they've been relatively lax with censoring, they try to avoid as much controversy as possible. Besides, I don't think Capcom wants a M rating for the PW series. Like I said, I don't think they ever intended PW to be anything more than a humorous lawyering sim.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 3:07 am

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Now that I think about it, it is odd that rape gets an M rating while murder dosent.

I guess its just cause PW skirts so much around the actual murder part...

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:27 am

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Brandon Strong wrote:

Now that I think about it, it is odd that rape gets an M rating while murder dosent.

I guess its just cause PW skirts so much around the actual murder part...

A rape case would probably revolve around the rape act so much that it would be pretty gross and unappropiate for children, therefore making the rating to be raised (which I guess would not be good for sales). And featuring a rape case on a game would probably raise a lot of polemic and bad press. I don't thing neither Capcom nor Nintendo will risk their profit for that.

And finally, I think I personally prefer reading testimonies about someone who got killed or seeing pictures of a corpse on Phoenix Wright than reading a description on how someone got rapped by another person, not to mention the pictures...

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:41 am

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Personally, as a player, I'd love to have my sensibilities and morals challenged when faced with such a controversial issue like rape. It would definitely add to the personality of the characters in the game, as well, since it would evoke very dramatic responses from them, not just audience.

I realize, though, that it just wouldn't happen, because of society being the way it is. It's not that I'm indifferent to rape or see it as a novelty (far from it) - au contraire, it's a very deep and emotional issue for me. I'd like to be able to relate that part of myself to my video games, somehow, instead of feeling like my culture is stifling my experiences and thoughts.

But that, as they say, is another story.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:46 am

ClintTheChocolic

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While I personally don't mind games with challenging moral questions, I don't think I want to see any of them in PW (and jesus, no, please don't quote JFA case 4.) I just don't see how the goofy exxagerated character animations can work with a serious moral overtone (or how the PW humor would work for that matter.) The humor has always been the main ingredient of the games, and IMO, that's what makes PW works in the first place. If you ask me, I'm pretty certain I don't want PW to turn into a generic episode of Law & order : SVU or god forbid, one of those serious lawyer dramas on TV.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 1:53 pm

Croik

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I agree with Clint. PW may be a game about murder but there's always been a light-hearted quality about it. But you can't really treat an issue like rape with anything less than absolute seriousness, and...thinking about the kinds of sprites Odoroki has (since we can be reasonably sure that any new GS games are going to be with Odoroki) I'd hate to see him tackle that kind of issue.

Besides, a rape case would inevitably force you to take a different kind of evidence, like...semen samples and such. That would definately up the rating.

Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 2:07 pm

MercuryKitten

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That and a lot more people would probably be bothered by it...Seeing as there are rape victims still living while as most murder victims probably wouldn't be playing Phoenix Wright, being dead and all.

Everyone's right. For some reason, it's easier to take murder less seriously. Maybe because murder has so many different possible happenings...I don't even know. But I'm not sure if I would be comfortable with rape straight out. Maybe if a relationship was involved in a murder and if it was hinted at, maybe. But not just a plain rape case. Besides, if it was only a rape case the victim would still be alive and yeah.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:23 pm

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I wouldn't mind a law suit type thing as long as there was something exciting underground like the copyright infringer being a mass-murderer.

Croik wrote:

Though it would be interesting to have an assault where the victim survived and spends the duration of the trial in a coma or something.

I'm actually putting that into a case in the game I'm making :P

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:48 pm

Immortal FeatherLLS

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Aijiru wrote:

Brandon Strong wrote:

Now that I think about it, it is odd that rape gets an M rating while murder dosent.

I guess its just cause PW skirts so much around the actual murder part...

A rape case would probably revolve around the rape act so much that it would be pretty gross and unappropiate for children

But Murder is ok? Not saying I want a Rape trial, would be kinda weird. I just think they could do something a little more interesting than Murder if they pulled off a theft case.

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Re: Maybe the murder is a little too much

Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:04 pm

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Which seems more disturbing? Spend a whole case looking at a dead body or spend a whole case watching someone get penetrated? Answer that question and it will all become clear.

EDIT: OBTW, a theft case has already been done.

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