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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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But that still doesn't answer my question, Gerk.

Spoiler:
If Barbossa had the eye and was a Lord from the beginning, there's no way he would have been serving as Jack's first mate on a ship that wasn't his. Which means he had to have gotten the eye AFTER betraying Jack. I guess you could assume another pirate gave it to him at some point, but they kind of implied with Elizabeth that the item gets passed down from captain to crewmate. Why would any pirate, even on the brink of death, hand off his or her item to another captain they know to be guilty of mutiny? (Since Barbossa was sailing around on the Black Pearl, which they should have known belonged to Jack, since he's also one of the Lords). Unless as pirates they don't care about mutiny...?

It only makes sense to say that Barbossa stole the eye from someone else after having betrayed Jack. But if he has no trouble stealing such an item from another captain, why not steal Jack's to begin with?

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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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But of course the correct answer to all of the questions is that they're plot holes due to bad writing.
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Well at least Davy's widdle bucket should have warranted a few giggles.
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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One little thing that bugged me after seeing this movie...

It was aid before Calypso was put into human form, she "controlled" the sea. For whatever reason, that was bad. What exactly did "controlling the sea" mean, anyway?
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Croik wrote:
Just because we disagree doesn't mean we didn't read your review, btw. Though admittedly I skipped over most of it because it sounded like a lot of empty praise.


Fair Enough. But I don't believe in empty praise. I genuinely loved the film, and I hope my writing proved that I loved it without being some Goddamn quote whore.

Croik wrote:
BTW, here's some plot holes I couldn't quite figure out:

Spoiler: "On Barbossa and the pirate lords"
If Barbossa knew that Jack was one of nine pirate lords, who carried a special item designating himself as such, which he HAD to pass on before his death, why did he not try to take it from Jack when he stranded him (twice) on a deserted island?

Or for that matter, how did Barbossa become a Lord himself when up until ten years ago he was Jack's first mate? You'd think if he was going to mutiny against Jack and steal his ship, he would at least take the Piece of Eight with him. Which means he didn't become a lord until AFTER leaving Jack and becomming cursed. But who would make a cursed mutineer a pirate lord? And if he wasn't *made* a lord but rather stole the wooden eye from some other lord...that brings us back to the question of why didn't he just steal Jack's in the first place?


And no, "the writers didn't know about the 3rd movie when they made the 1st" doesn't count. :grossburg:


My guess? It would be more insulting if Barbosa let Jack die as a pirate lord. Or just that he was secretly wishing they would never have to
Spoiler: Spoiler
summon Calypso.


It an unavoidable hole, but there is a book coming out on when Jack met Barbosa and possiby the mutiny that took place, so Barbosa's intentions will be made clear.
Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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Zetto San wrote:
Croik wrote:
BTW, here's some plot holes I couldn't quite figure out:

Spoiler: "On Barbossa and the pirate lords"
If Barbossa knew that Jack was one of nine pirate lords, who carried a special item designating himself as such, which he HAD to pass on before his death, why did he not try to take it from Jack when he stranded him (twice) on a deserted island?

Or for that matter, how did Barbossa become a Lord himself when up until ten years ago he was Jack's first mate? You'd think if he was going to mutiny against Jack and steal his ship, he would at least take the Piece of Eight with him. Which means he didn't become a lord until AFTER leaving Jack and becomming cursed. But who would make a cursed mutineer a pirate lord? And if he wasn't *made* a lord but rather stole the wooden eye from some other lord...that brings us back to the question of why didn't he just steal Jack's in the first place?


And no, "the writers didn't know about the 3rd movie when they made the 1st" doesn't count. :grossburg:


My guess? It would be more insulting if Barbosa let Jack die as a pirate lord. Or just that he was secretly wishing they would never have to
Spoiler: Spoiler
summon Calypso.


It an unavoidable hole, but there is a book coming out on when Jack met Barbosa and possiby the mutiny that took place, so Barbosa's intentions will be made clear.


Ah, that's an easy one.

Barbosa stranded him on a deserted island? Did he now? He could have known about the 'sea turtles' (AKA the smugling ring) there. He KNEW Jack would survive. The crew wouldn't want it any other way.

For the rest of the act, Barbosa and crew were taken under that spell. Really, they are already as good as dead, and there is no reason why they should care wether or not they need to summon some god. Why? Because they were doomed to fade away. I think when they wanted the curse lifted they didn't think they would survive afterwards.

As for how he became a pirate lord, do as Mia says. Stop doubting the facts. We KNOW that the pirate lords became so during the first meeting, and we KNOW that one-eye was there, as his eye was one of the pieces. Assume barbosa became a pirate lord at that time... and think it through! Instead of asking WHEN he became a pirate lord, ask WHY be became a pirate lord. If you can figure that out, you got your case! Can you think of anything? Mmm?

Spoiler: No I can't!
Turn to page 245, the inevitable 'game over' page.


Spoiler: I think I can!
Barbosa wanted to take over the Black Pearl.

Okay, it's really simple. The nine pieces of eight were done at the first meeting, right? Think of it this way: theres a contradiction, right? nine pieces of eight? It's never explained why this is. My guess is that mister one-eye "accidently" dropped his eye in the mix during the spell, making Barbosa, even as a first mate, a pirate lord "ageanst his will". Technically, it would make one-eye pirate lord, but he would easily give it to Barbosa if he asked for it. He obviously would have done it on purpose - so that Barbosa could get a say in things. This alone could give him enough might to take over the ship after Jack. Nobody tries to take over the ship of a PIRATE LORD besides another pirate lord.

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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Mikker, you're forgetting the fact that the first meeting of pirate lords was years and years ago. Barbossa said it himself: "There has never been a meeting like this in our lifetime." He was never one of the first.

And the idea that Barbossa "stranded" Jack on an island he knew Jack would be rescued from defeats the point entirely, and...is just plain ridiculous. That's an even bigger logic trap than what I mentioned.

Quote:
It's an unavoidable hole, but there is a book coming out on when Jack met Barbosa and possiby the mutiny that took place, so Barbosa's intentions will be made clear.


There's no such thing as an inevitable plot hole. It's a writer's job to make sure that doesn't happen.
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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ah, crap. Missed that.

Oh well, objection sustained I guess. :sadshoe:
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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How's this for a theory?
Spoiler: Pirate Lord theory
Barbosa became a pirate lord before becoming Jack's first mate (maybe his dad was a pirate lord or something). Now, as stated, the pirate lords have never met in their lifetime, so its possible they didn't know who each other are. As such, neither Barbosa nor Jack knew that the other was a pirate lord. Barbosa planned his mutiny in advance, and became Jack's first mate for the purpose of stealing the Pearl. Since he didn't know Jack was a pirate lord, he abandoned him with his piece of eight, not knowing to steal it. They didn't recognize each other as pirate lords until sometime after the events of Curse of the Black Pearl. Calypso likely made sure they knew not to kill each other, as the only way to free her was if they all were present with their pieces of eight.

This would explain it, but I'm likely overlooking something.
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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That would explain it, but I still don't really see why Barbossa would be running around without his own ship and crew if he was a lord. Unless he got shipwrecked and everyone died, I guess.

Or, for that matter, how you could NOT know who the other pirate lords are, if you were one. That also seems to kind of defeat the point of having them, if none of them really know who the other is or what item they have to present to prove it.

But then, pirates aren't too smart....
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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I saw it last weekened and... well, I didn't like it that much.

Don't get me wrong, there were tons of great scenes. Singapore. Jack's first hallucination. The crew returning to the real world. Keith Richards. The maelstrom. Etcetec.

But it did plenty of bad things too. Pirates 3's plot is convulted and pretty hard to follow, full of contradictions and odd logic (Barbaosa mentioned "heathen gods" in Pirates 1, is now freeing one; code is now absolute rules? I thought they were guidelines!; Barbosa can be revived from a shot to the heart but Jack can't be revived from being eaten) as well as getting ridiculous. I accepted a curse that turns you into the living dead- that's fine. But this story goes over the top, namely with the goddess Calypso. What was the point of this subplot?! It served no purpose other than to set up for the maelstrom. The whole Pirate Lords thing is pretty odd too, because somehow Barbosa is Pirate Lord and I find the idea of an organisation of pirates, complete with elections, a bit... odd.

And there was way too much of Jack. Yes, he's a great character- but I don't want him pushing every character out of the spotlight. Barbosa in particular is great, and I wish he got a bigger role. Will, as much as I disliked him, actually seemed to be pretty good in this one, so it's a shame we never got to see more of him. Especially with his betrayals and all, he would have been interesting to watch. Actually, I think the only person who wasn't pushed aside was Elizabeth, but sadly this was for the worse. She is fucking awful and unrealistic. I mean come on- she's now a fullblown pirate? How does one go from a highranking, pampered citizen to the fucking king of pirates?! Hell, did she even have any motivation to travel around on the Pearl this time?

It was better than Dead Man's Chest, but the original is still easily the best.
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seconded. Are orignals almost always the best?
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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I saw it...two days ago, I believe. Anyway, I thought it was just ok.

I like the 1st one the best...
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Android 21 3/7 wrote:
seconded. Are orignals almost always the best?


Sadly, yes.
Holy Hell wrote:
Raven Darkheart wrote:
it is when you look underneath the underneath
It's not a hole in the wall. It is a wall surrounding a hole.
Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title

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Also, I'd say most of these plot hole you guys are debating here only exist because maybe.... They hadn't planned EXACTLY how the third movie was going to go at the time they were writing the first?
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It doesn't matter, there shouldn't be any plot holes and contradictions either way.
Holy Hell wrote:
Raven Darkheart wrote:
it is when you look underneath the underneath
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

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I just saw PoC:AWE today. All in all it exceeded my expectations terrifically. Visually superb, funny and random.

I did however find the plot a bit broken, like the second one. It's kind of hard to keep track of what their trying to achieve with so many layers of plot, humour and fighting.
First of all, When did Barbosa become good?

Also, another thing bothers me. Did anyone stay through the credits to see the end bit? If I had not been told about the bit after the credits, I certainly wouldn't have stayed to find out, the credits were like 10 minutes long!
And, Elizabeth hadn't aged a bit in those 10 years? Ridiculosity!

Also, that scar on Will looked nasty.

All in all, a fair 8/10. Pretty good as far as Third films go.
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In Pirates of the Carribean At World's End, I think it was well put together, but that's all it was.
Spoiler:
I hated the whole thing about what happened to Will and Jack, what many fans wanted to happen just didn't. I also don't understand anything about all those crabs :larry2:

You would find out something in the movie and then the next scene wouldn't make any sence. It was just to much for me :meekins:
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khaaan! wrote:
(Barbosa can be revived from a shot to the heart but Jack can't be revived from being eaten)


Calypso said something about Jack "not dying but being having his soul taken away from the living world". I didn't get it either, though. Just accept things as they are and they'll more or less make sense. That's how I always see it.
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I didn't like it, I never thought PotC to be a film that demanded a sequal, let alone a trilogy. I wish Disney would stop making milk every successful movie for as much as they can get.
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I just read that Kiera said she's no longer working in PoTC, so don't expect her in the sequal
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Pirates of the Caribbean 4!

All I have to say is...

Spoiler:
Atlantis...? Are they serious?


I can see everyone on this board rioting because of "ZOMG MORE JACK SPARROW!!!111 *upchuck*" or "ZOMG MORE PLOTHOLES *dies*". To be completely honest, I like Jack Sparrow. He's the main protagonist; how can he be completely ignored? That's like ignoring Phoenix and trying to find some unique quality about a minor character who serves no purpose other than to act as a small part of a bigger equation.

I JUST DON'T GET IT!!
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Re: Pirates of the Caribbean 3: At World's EndTopic%20Title
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Well, they've had the Flying Dutchman, Davy Jones, and all the other sea legends already, so Atlantis makes.. sense for PotC.

I expect the Bermuda-triangle sooner or later, too ;)
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Hmm, my friend told me that they weren't going to make anymore POTC movies.
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I didn't care for the plot much.
I just saw it for the kickass fighting and the humor, basically and there is no denying that fact.

Massive lulz goes to "This is madness..." "This is politics" part.
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Id say it sucks. I don't really think that, I'm just saying that because I'm trying to get people as mad at me as possible while I'm on my CAFFEINE FUELED RAGE!!!!
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That was just a mini-anger rant I was going on.
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